Thursday, January 31, 2013

[gita-talk] Re: The Bhagavad Gita - Daily Message - 9-21

 

||   Shree Hari   ||




II  9:21 II

 

Te tam bhuktvaa svargalokam visaalam

Ksine punye martyalokam visanti

Evam trayidharmamanuprapannaa

Gataagatam kaamakaamaa labhante (Gita 9:21)

 

Having long enjoyed, the heavenly world, and their merit is exhausted, they return to the mortal world.  Thus taking recourse to action with interested motive, enjoined by the three Vedas, and desiring desires (seeking worldly enjoyments), they obtain what is transient (repeatedly come and go). 

Comments: 

Those individuals who carry out good work, when they have exhausted all their sins then they go to the heavens (swarg lok).  On enjoying the pleasures of heaven and exhausting all their good deeds, then they return to the world of mortals.  Due to worldly desires, these men continuously come and go in the cycle of birth and death. 


From Gita Prabodhani by Swami Ramsukhdasji

=============================================================

 
Please listen to -


http://www.swamiramsukhdasji.net/Audio/Audio-Bhagavad-Gita-Hindi-Gita-Press/Audio_Bhagavad-Gita-GP-Hindi.htm


     

For Book Purchases outside of India  

eBook Gita Prabodhani -  Hindi 


GITA PATH BY BAJARANGJI SONI 

The Bhagavadgita - SADHAK SANJIVANI ENGLISH

The Bhagavadgita - Sadhak Sanjivani HINDI AUDIO

LINKS TO GITA PAATH and GITA DISCOURSES by various saints

BHAGAVAD GITA AARTI 

Five Gita verses for daily recitation
Gita 4/6-10 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRKYyYt6hJ8&feature=related
------------------------------------------------------------
PLEASE VIEW YOU TUBE BHAJAN IN SWAMIJI'S VOICE

 
Swamiji - 

Other Bhajan

Thank you,  Ram Ram  

----------------------------------------------


ENGLISH WEBSITE: www.swamiramsukhdasji.net
HINDI WEBSITE: www.swamiramsukhdasji.org
HINDI BLOG: www.satcharcha.blogspot.com
To receive daily spiritual message,
Subscribe:sadhaka-subscribe@yahoogroups.com(daily spiritual message)
Subscribe:gita-talk-subscribe@yahoogroups.com(for Gita discussion)

__._,_.___
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)
Recent Activity:
All past 4925+ messages are accessible and searchable at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gita-talk/

28,000+ sadhakas

A list of all topics discussed in 2009 along with their links are at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gita-talk/message/3189
.

__,_._,___

Tuesday, January 29, 2013

[gita-talk] Re: Is there Really God?

 

Respected all, I'm an human being I was married and had a nice 16 year married
life. Last month 20th my wife expired due to cancer. During last seven months I
never left even a single second from praying to God except sleep. But God has
not listened to my prayers and he took my wife.Its alright that every one has to
die But why god has given such horrible pain to my wife. she was such a good
person never did anyone any harm. If what you people believe if really God is
there why He had given such a bad disease to her and so much suffering. Don't
give excuses like purva janma paapa and all. If really God is there why God is
not punishing me after my wife's death i am spitting on his calender idols
photos. what crime my daughter has done who will take care of her now now i want
to die. Due to my daughter I am surviving. Tell me is there really God?

N. P.

----------------------------------------------------


Ram Ram 

I heard this a couple of days back and I thought about you,  and I thought you may benefit from a part of this satsang  by Swamiji.    Go to 28 minutes into the satsang.. 


also attaching URL - http://www.swamiramsukhdasji.net/Audio/AUDIO-HINDI/OTHER-PRAVACHANS/2001-04/20010426_0800-Apna-kyaa-Hai-Dukh-se-Unnati-Kahani.mp3

I believe it will be comforting.  
A sadhak, Ram Ram   

-----------------------------------------------------------

God exists. But He does not exist to make us all happy all the time in the way
we wish to bbe happy and away from sorrow and sadness. Each person or being or
object has its (his/ her) own path of transformation. Each such transformation
including illness and death or escape from them are destined to happen as per
the Laws of God (Nature). God only can help in giving the strength to persons to
become independent of and unperturbed by events that we normally refer to as
giving rise to sorrow and happiness. Just as God Himself is bound by the laws of
God (Nature) but is unperturbed by events and developments as they occur, there
is an opportunity for each human being to become independent of and unperturbed
by developments and events in life and there are various methods by which one
can try to imbibe that property in oneself. Loss of wife at an early age,
especially after painful suffering is indeed a very sad event. God can help us
only to get the strength to overcome the effect of this loss and pain so that we
can continue to with the rest of life. God's existence is required for even
this purpose.
Basudeb Sen

----------------------------------------------------

dont say god if you want say srishtikarta creator nature which is giving you air to breathe, waer to drink and food to eat one seed sown mother earth does not eat that she gives back bountiful crop, one mango seed sown will give you tonnes of mangoes and you will export and earn..one who believes in himself believe god, hence have self confidence, in ramayana and mahabharata see each charecter suffered so much sita, draupadi, kunti, gandhari and all the charecter, why 5148 years back read the life story of holy mother sharada devi 1853 to 1920 how she suffered when her husband sri ramakrishna passed away due to cancer in 1886, she did not have one paise for salt just boiled grass and ate for a year..cheer up
god bless you
swamiji  (SWAMI KRISHNANANDA) 


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

dear N P.  Please read chapter 2 of BG. .  All the best.    G

---------------------------------------

Dear Sadaks,
Very clear N.P. loved his wife more than GOD from the expressionhe posted. Many saints like Thygaraya, Ramanujar, Anamachariyar etc lost their wife. But they became more stable in Bakthi
B.S

------------------------------------------------------------------------

N.P.
I really feel sorry for your wifes death,God really can give you happiness & sorrow but a person can not blame god only, I understand you dont like to hear about purva janam but still its all in gods hand & he  is the only one, knows whom to give what? & why thats even god knows too one should always be patient & not blame god also please NEVER SPIT ON GODS CALENDER thats sin you are doing & that shows how shelfish you are that the day you found about bad health of your wife you started praying god just to tell him save my wife & just not listening your prayer you got mad & started spiting thats where you are WRONG in thinking wise I am sorry I am writing you all this & showing yours fault but you should never spit on gods calender at all.
May be if you still trust god & pray him with out conditions he can bring your life in to happiness by showing you like your daughter make you so happy as she might get best luck in her life so please believe in god & pray him with good heart & then tell god what ever you give us life as long as you pray him let god take all your obstacle in life, again I am sorry if I have hurted yours feelings but just be positive,
may god bless you & take your obstacles in life 

RP
------------------------------------------

Namaste N.P.
I am very sorry for your loss. Non of us can even imagine what you are going
through. It seems that destiny cannot be changed and there is a higher reason
for everything that happened even if we can't see it. God is all merciful and
omniscient and he sees that Everything that's happening in the world are for the
highest good, even if you pray to him or course him, he is looking out for best
interest. Praying to God will not change the outcome but it will change the way
you feel about it and give you strength and the right knowledge to handle the 
situation the best way.


God Bless
\
Kishore
-----------------------------------------------------
Dear N.P.

I pray to Almighty to give her soul rest in peace and Heavenly bliss and give
you and your daughter strength to bear the loss of your loved ones.

You questioned "Tell me is there really God", in your mail below.

You could be aware that the Planet Earth on which we are living is called "MRITU
LOK and all creatures in this world have to extinct one day. Even sometimes
infants die in a day or two after their birth even without seeing this world. 
What will you say about this and whom will you blame, naturally you will say its
God's act. True. But you and I and no one in this universe comes to know as to
why this happened to newly born infants. For our comfortable or to vent out our
anger (due to grief) we utter indecent words for God who is not physically
present their to reply the queries. But we all get answers, if not immediately,
after sometime when we come out of our individual grief.

It seems you are doubtful about God's presence. (Whether I am right or not but I
have a feeling that you had prayed to God to save your wife's life but after her
death you expressed your anguish in this way. If it is so then I believe that
your disbelief in God is momentary in this hour of grief.)

I feel that nobody's answer could satisfy/pacify you at this stage of grim grief
except yourself. Instead of asking anybody about God's presence it is better
you search your soul and you will get the answer.

As far as question pertains of your spitting on Gods calender or His idols
photos I simply ask a question that what would be your reaction if your
daughter/someone else do the same act with you. Will you forgive or punish
them? Choice is yours. According to your choice the God's reaction will be
there but it may not be visible immediately because God never react in
haste/anger/emotion and always gives hundreds of opportunity for penance or to
accept the mistake and as soon as acceptance of mistake comes from the deep of
the hearts, God immediately forgive.

Finally I will say that TIME IS THE GREAT HEALER & TEACHER.


RCS

--------------------------------------------------

First of all, my sincere prayers for your wife, you and children.. I know, it
has been a difficult time for you but with understanding and courage you will be
able to overcome the grief and go on with life finding new meaning and purpose.

It may be good at this stage to park this question "Is there really God" and
devote your energies in taking care of your daughter, considering her to be a
lovely gift from your wife.. You will find your meaning/purpose/peace there. 
Only then you should revisit the question about existence of God, wisdom of
life, larger picture of life...

There are more than one way of looking at life/happening in life.... Each
perspective may give a different result/ meaning/ purpose to our lives...

Sushil Jain

-----------------------------------------------

God does not appear to do anything but leaves nothing undone.
Very Very Hurt for what has happened to you.
Please give all HOPE to the child.
Pain comes to all of us in some form or the other.
Be giving. Be a messenger of HOPE and stregnth for everyone around you.
We are all with you.
Deepak Gupta

-----------------------------------------------

Death is reunion with god.We are liberated from worldly bonds the moment we
enter the deaths fold.we come to the world alone and went alone.Wife and
children are worldly bonds.They are broken once we are taken by death.Spitting
on photos of god will not solve your grief.God is above spitting or
decorating.God is nirakara nirguna parabramha.We gave him a shape for our
sadhana.Photo calender and idol are not needed once we get theSELF awareness
Badri Narayana Miriyala

--------------------------------------------------

To see or talk about God, you have to be there. So, 'you' is all.
You and what you are observing, experiencing is a singular process.
One wants to escape the pain by complaining or by the ideas about God and so on.
All answers are escape from the pain, one is experiencing.
But if you have become so passionate about this questions, so serious about
these questions that you want an answer ‘Now’. No explanation, religious or
scientific is able to assuage the pain of these questions. You are bent upon.
Suddenly, you realize that no answer can undo the pain.You are Alone. From whom
you are seeking answers.
Now you will touch the original pain, the original resistance, the original
energy on which the Life is sustained.
The need for answe rs suddenly drops; you become the creative impulse of the
Universe.
Y V Chawla
--------------------------------------------------

Sri Rama Jaya Rama.

Respected Sir,

My sincere condolences sir. I pray for your family's peace. May God give you and
your family enough strength to bear with this loss. Sir, just stay calm and
silent for some more time and you will get the answer.

Regards,
PJ

-------------------------------------------------

I understand and I am really sorry for your wife death . I pray her soul rest in
Peace .

The incident has shattered your faith in God . I would like to tell you even I
get lot of Pains in Life , specially financial , even I think what wrong I have
done to other People why is it happened to me ..

I am very much sure the Almighty has got a reason behind every human suffering
on this Planet .if he has given us sufferings ,may be he wants us to realize
our own selfs . It is a Testing Period in our lifes , we need tobe pateint .

I am sure you will have a Happy times Ahead .


Hatim.S.Bootwala

------------------------------------------

dear NP
you are not the one who is suffering from such problems, one devoted soul got
married to a poor girl in 1983 after one daughter was born and small house built
in bangalore he went abroad to clear just 25000/- his wife became greedy when
finally he quit the job at the age of 47 to settle down in family his wife quit
him deserted him when he dint have job and money he put his sweat and blood for
18 years, he came to know his daughter earns more than one lakh per month and
his wife lives lavishly but he has become a monk and social activist working for
poor
hence be bold march on grief is the gift of god, dont wallow in self pity what
ever happens in life is for ones own good..1 to 25 brahmacharya...25 to 50
householder 50 to 75 vanaprasthashrama 75 to 100 sanyas,

if you are free let us know.
god bless you
swamiji SWAMI KRISHNANANDA

---------------------------------------------------
Dear N.P.
Namaskar!
At the outset please accept my humble sympathy for the trouble you have faced
due to your wife's disease and lately her leaving you for ever!

Now the direct answer to your question put as Is there Really God? The answer is
both yes and No depending on what is your conception of GOD!!

Let me explain the answer to you keeping strictly your punar-janam and things
like that away. If you feel that GOD is some identity sitting somewhere in the
universe or beyond then I would certainly say that there is no such GOD existing
anywhere!But if you feel you exist, your daughter exist and your wife existed
and this universe exists then yes, GOD exists which is the root cause of
everything you can and cannot conceive. In simplest words I would say what you
call yourself as true YOU that is GOD, who I just mentioned exists!!!

Coming to your logical thinking that you want to die after your wife's death but
for that your daughter, clearly shows that you feel that your living has a
meaning and so you continue to live.

Finally why GOD is not punishing you since you all the time are spitting on his
idols & Photo ,again shows that he exists. You are always remembering him as
before wife's death for which he would return you with suitable gift sometime
later....you cannot keep record for that due to your insufficient caliber and
vision!

Hope you are satisfied with the answer!
I am
KKK
(Kuldeep Kumar Kaul)

------------------------------------------------
Defeat the defeat before defeat defeats you

Dr.Ramesh Kamath

-----------------------------------------------

Dear NP,



I would not say that I can feel your pain and agony, because actually no one can
do that. What you are experiencing and going through, is tragic and I really
feel sad for that.

I will not explain the answer to your question, but I would rather like to share
that how I found the solution of the same question when it came to me, in my
life. Let me say that I belong to science stream and does not believe on
anything, until unless I have a proof of it.

Almost everybody faces some bad time in their life, and I also had gone through
my share of hard time. And several thoughts came to my mind like dark clouds.

"Is there any God?"

Because if there is God, why I am suffering, even after remembering him
sincerely?
Why so many natural calamities claiming the life of innocents? What wrong those
little ones did in their life for which their parents were taken away in the
tsunami of Bay of Bengal.
If there is God, then why he is unable to protect a girl from the brutal hands
of rapists?
If there is God, then why so many people are dying of hunger?
And similar hundreds of questions and doubts flooded my mind.
Then some additional thoughts came:

How come Draupadi was insulted in the Kaurav sabha, even when Shri Krishna was
their on earth? Although he saved him in the last, but why she suffered so much
humiliation, and insult?
How come Pandavas, who were very near and dear to Shri Krishna were roaming in
the jungle for years? Even though Shri Krishna was very much there.
And how surprising it is that, how come Abhimanyu (who was the nephew of Krishna
himself) was killed by Kauravas?
Then similar thoughts regarding suffering of God men of present times came to
mind.

Why Shri Ramkrishna paramhamsa went through the pain of cancer in his last days?
Similarly why the same happened with Shri Hanuman Prasad Poddar? (he also
suffered with cancer of throat)


After a few months of doubts and questioning again the pillars of my faith
resurfaced, I again gave a thought to facts which supports my faith in existence
of God. Let me summarize them in brief.

The same Ramakrishna paramhansa ji at that time replied to the mental query of
Vivekananda, who doubted him after seeing his bodily suffering.
Cases of rebirths, or in other words past life memories in some children. There
is no satisfactory scientific explanation for this phenomenon.
My experience of witnessing some accurate jyotish predictions.
Some of my remarkable clairvoyant dreams, before the important life changing
events of my life. (before getting selected in a competitive exam, and before my
marriage)
Real miraculous events in the life of my ancestors (my father, my grandfather
and his great grandfather), which were possible only if God is there. Those
events cannot be explained on scientific grounds. (not going in the details of
the events).
And so many other observations.
Scientific proofs that life was created by God, and cannot begin by itself as
taught in the science classes at present.


Again I regained my faith to some extent, but the questions against the God were
still unanswered.

I am sure that God is very much there, but how come he is unable to help the
humanity to get rid of the sufferings and pains? Thought analysis went on in my
mind and finally I found the answers. These are listed below.

Answer to the Q "why the earth cannot be a heaven full of all comforts and
bliss? " : The creation is created and run by three gunas of prakriti (stva,
raj and tam) and all three are required to sustain the material creation.
somewhere the stva guna is more and some where the tamo guna is more. There is
nothing in this creation which is devoid of any of these three gunas. Let me say
in simple words, that if we have to make a beautiful painting, we have to use
all sort of colours, a picture cannot be made by white colour only. Therefore
there is pain also in this world, and happiness and bliss is also there. And
until unless one has attained the moksha, he is liable to suffer the four
kleshas of the life "janma, maran, jara and vyadhi". (Imagine what will happen
if nobody will die, this world will be over populous. Imagine if there is no
thirst and hunger, and no necessities – people will become lazy, nothing to do
at all, why to work, there will be no theif, no police, no doctor, no engineer,
no sinner, no saint, no celebration, all the world will come to a standstill, as
happened in the beginning of creation when Narad ji preached the sons of Brahma
and all of them went to the jungle to perform the penance and the creation could
not sustain).
Is there any truth in karma siddhanta? Whether we have to suffer for our past
life karmas? Is this a reality, or mere a justification given by God men to
satisfy the answers of a suffering person? Answer: until unless we see
something happening before our own eyes, it is hard to believe. For me I have
experienced the truth of karma siddhanta in two ways – one is some accurate
predictions of jyotish, and second is some of my premonitory dreams, and the
third is the cases of rebirth. Therefore I believe very much in karma siddhanta.
(you may say that my evidences are unscientific and not dependable. Then kindly
suggest some scientific way to either prove or disprove it. And I should mention
here that I have studied the science till now in my life and working for
science. Science is a methodology by which we try to understand the happenings
in the nature. But there are still many happenings for which we do not have
sufficient means to prove or disprove. Then what should be done in these
circumstances? Would it be wise to disregard at the outset, all those
observations, which are truly happening, but we cannot test them in our lab due
to incapacity of our current scientific might).
Q. finally if we accept that God is there and karma siddhant is true, then also
why God is not helping the people? Answer: Bhagwan says "Karmanyev adhikaraste,
ma faleshu kadachana", you have all the rights to do any sort of action and
effort, but you do not have the right of their results. There are three types of
karmas in jyotish dridh, adridh and dridhadridh. Out of these only the fala of
adridh and dridhadridh karmas can be modified by your efforts, and devotion.
Personally I feel that even the dridha karmfala can also be averted but it needs
a herculean effort. To prevent the death of a near and dear one you really need
the devotion and penance of the level of Savitiri, who snatched the life of her
husband from the hands of Yama.
Final question: Why there is so much sin in the society? Is it also being done
by the will of God? Answer: No, God only created the creation with the help of
prakriti and its three gunas. These three gunas are constantly flowing, and
there random combinations result in many different kinds of happenings. Some of
them may be good and sometimes it is bad. God only incarnate himself when this
balance is perturbed beyond its limits designated for a particular yuga
(currently it is Kaliyuga).
Bhagwan says in the beginning of 9th chapter of Bhagwad Gita that, although I
have created all the creation within myself, but see the might of my Yogmaya
that this creation is not within me even though it is situated in me only, and I
am also not within it although I am there within every part of it. Explanation
of this verse may be many and difficult to understand. But I took the simple and
direct meaning, which is observed and felt by a common man like me. But in the
end of the same chapter Bhagwan says that "ye bhajanti tu maam bhaktyaa, mayi te
teshu chapyaham" those who remember me with love and devotion, I manifest in
themselves, and they are always within me. To me this is the supreme hidden
message, if we combine the initial part of this chapter with the concluding
part. Although the God is not manifesting himself in this creation despite his
being everywhere, he will manifest within you, if you remember him with love and
devotion.
Finally I do not want to intervene in the fight between you and your God. Let
you and your God resolve this issue yourself. But it is also true that even if
you fight with him, he is still smiling and loving you.



With love and regards

Dharmendra Sharma

-------------------------------------------------

Dear Gita-Talk member,

My heart-felt sorrow for your loss. I feel for your pain.
Yes, there is God.

God Bless you. Bye!

Notesh Otes
-----------------------------------------

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES for RESPONDER: PLEASE -

1. Only responses that are BRIEF, RELEVANT and further clarify Gita message will
be posted. All responses will not be posted. Responses that conflict with
scriptures and Swamiji's writings will not be posted.
2. Sadhaks are encouraged to quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible.
3. Sadhaks must be RESPECTFUL of all Sadhaks and must limit personal feelings,
opinions, beliefs etc. to the extent that they further help in understanding the
Gita shlokas
5. Sadhaks must not include links to the other sites; personal information (Ph
#, address etc) or personalize message to particular person
6. Sadhaks must keep in mind novices, youth, westerners, non-sectarian audience.
Limit the use to Sanskrit words and provide English word bracketed.


GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE - FOR QUESTIONER

1. The questions MUST be BRIEF, and must point out the particular daily sadhak
message that is in doubt. The questions must be relevant to Gita, Dharma, or
other scriptures.
2. The Questioner must commit to feedback at end of discussion to bring closure
3. Only one question at a time.


GITA TALK MODERATORS
Ram Ram

----------------------------------------------



ENGLISH WEBSITE: www.swamiramsukhdasji.net
HINDI WEBSITE: www.swamiramsukhdasji.org
HINDI BLOG: www.satcharcha.blogspot.com
To receive daily spiritual message,
Subscribe:sadhaka-subscribe@yahoogroups.com(daily spiritual message)
Subscribe:gita-talk-subscribe@yahoogroups.com(for Gita discussion)
Unsubscribe:gita-talk-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com


__._,_.___
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (3)
Recent Activity:
All past 4925+ messages are accessible and searchable at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gita-talk/

28,000+ sadhakas

A list of all topics discussed in 2009 along with their links are at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gita-talk/message/3189
.

__,_._,___