Tuesday, July 24, 2012

[gita-talk] Re: Swamiji … an alien's appreciation

 

Swamiji … an alien's appreciation (Part-I; I do not know how many parts it will run into!)

I sense and understand certain discomfort in certain sector of Swamiji's "followers" in the group. I truly empathize their imagination that I could be disrespecting "Swamiji"! Nishaji (and all others with similar sentiments), you can come over and beat the heck out of this idiot anytime. I truly savor it with Love and Respects. Please feel free to express your anguish and anger.

If a person jabbers in Greek to a Hindi speaking crowd, it certainly irritates the crowd. But, to a Greek, Greek remains the clearest mode of communication; the content remains intact with the intent with such clarity. FROM SPIRITUAL PERSPECTIVE, THE MOST NATURAL EXPRESSION IS THE BEST - Shreyaan swadharmo viguNah! A "Greek" expression is the most natural to a Greek!! But, the language does not and should not make any difference to the content! A Hindi being unable to appreciate a Greek does not necessarily make the Greek "wrong"! Sameway, one's appreciation of Greek does not make the Greek "right" either!! Irrespectively, the Greek expression remains as IS for sure!!!

From your perspective, reference to Swamiji may be missing in the postings transacted through this fellow. As a truthful associate of a truthful seeker, nothing but the truth is ever referenced in one's natural expression. Swamiji, THE TRUTH, alone is referred all the while from this fellow since the fellow here is trying to emulate the same truthful appreciation from deep within that resounds from deep within Swamiji as well. Emphatic display of one's loyalty to The Truth is meaningless ... sometimes even harmful. Being with and in THE TRUTH is all that is relevant. This reminds me of a story.

PaanDavas were religiously chanting KrishNa Bhajan every day in morning, in mid-day and in evening religiously. In fact, innumerable sages and saints around in the forest also gathered in the divine Satsangas. Not even a day, Bhima ever bothered to be present in the singing and prayers. Other PaanDavas were quite upset with their brother's indifference to The Lord! They reproached him. Bhima laughed aloud and said "You are talking about My KrishNa?! HE is here with me all the time. What is the need to call out for somebody who is always with me??!!". Others were dismayed at Bhima's confidence. Bhima threw his massive mace and stood below that. The mace could crush mountains with its power. Bhima did not move. The Lord held the mace back to the crowd's amazement.

I see Swamiji as THE TRUTH. Not just in the few words or phrases or even ideologies expressed here and there! A truth-seeker cannot distinguish between THE TRUTH and the ones who have sought merger in the same!! In fact, until I resolve all the conflicts with THE TRUTH from within, I cannot say I have merged with THE TRUTH where Swamiji has sought his own merger with. Therefore, appreciation of THE TRUTH as IS remains most fundamental to reach Swamiji (or any other TRUTH-SEEKER per say), be with THE TRUTH that he savors as he IS as EVER, and savor the same TRUTH as I AM and as EVER. That is the only "reading" and "referencing" that really matters to me ... I am sure to Swamiji as well :).

When an alien such as this fellow here says it does not see truth … it implicitly means it failed to see certain things in the same manner that Swamiji might have possibly "seen". You see, the "seen" depends on many other "seens" from the past and remains captive within an infinite grid of "seens". If one's focus is on the locus of what is "seen", the superficial sceneries occupy the witness. When one's attention shifts to THE TRUTH that runs beneath all such "seens" ... one would "see" The Truth and nothing else.

Therefore … when I do not "see" what others "see" or what Swamiji "sees", it DOES NOT MEAN I do not appreciate what I could not see. Synchronizing my vision with my appreciation is the true seeking to me.

Chantining his ideas or ideologies that are transmitted through several media such as writings and re-writings do not make a difference to this fellow. It believes, being THE TRUTH is the only way it can be settled with any other truth-seeker such as Swamiji. Therefore, if this fellow's jabbering do not resonate with the chants of ideas and ideologies that the others do ... it is just a linguistic scatter. Trust me. How can it ever disrespect THE TRUTH?! How can it ever NOT REFERENCE to THE TRUTH??!! Either you have to be patient to appreciate its alien language. Or, the alien has to learn your languages. But this alien knows how it seriously lacks reading skills and ability to learn new languages! Yet, it is making a sincere attempt to appreciate the ideas and ideologies to its best abilities. So limited its abilities are, you can ignore its jabbering as it ought to be ... if it still offends any :).

Respects.

Naga Narayana.

==========================================

When you reach some final conclusions from this discussion, then kindly share with me in one sentence.

HINDI

jab is muddepar vaad-vivaad sampann ho jaaye to kripayaa ek vaakyamen usakaa saar mujhe bhee bataaiyegaa.
saadhaka

--------------------------------------------------

Naga Narayana,
Your writing is mind-boggling. However I fail to understand the meaning of the word that is most repeated in the discussion - the word truth.
What is truth? I was born a Christian but am now an agnostic. In the bible there is the scene of Jesus being tried by the Roman governor Pontius Pilate. In the course of the trial Pilate asks many questions of Jesus and Jesus answers them and most of Jesus' answers contain the word truth or refer to it. Then Pilate asks Jesus the question I have asked above "What is truth?"
Jesus is floored with this question and remains silent. Christian zealots and apologists say that Jesus remained silent because the question did not deserve an answer. But to me it seems that like most speakers Jesus was bantering about truth without even once asking himself the all important question "What is truth?"
You get into a discussion with anyone on anything - godmen, religion, spirituality, alternate medicines, magic, the Bible, teh Quran, the Geetha etc - and invariably the word truth pops out without anyone even bothering about answering the question "What is truth?"

Xavier William

very good one i would like to share here a small write up of gita in this short presentation so everything is situational or contextual Ultimately we shall understand the brief wisdom ofÂ
THE BHAGAWAD GITA . Gita’s door is wide open to anyone who knocks. It occurs in the Bhishma parva of mahabharatha and comprises eighteen chapters from 25th to 42nd.This good book of practical living marked a positive revolution in Hinduism.

THE BHAGAWAD GITAÂ

I have simplified it as follows for easy and quick referenceÂ

Why do you worry without cause?Â
Whom do you fear without reason?Â
Who can kill you?Â
The soul is neither born, nor does it die.Â

Whatever happened,Â
happened for the good;Â
whatever is happening,Â
is happening for the good;Â
whatever will happen,Â
will also happen for the good only.Â

You need not have any regrets for the past.Â
You need not worry for the future.Â

The present is happening...Â
What did you lose that you cry about?Â

What did you bring with you,Â
which you think you have lost?Â

What did you produce,Â
which you think got destroyed?Â

You did not bring anything,Â
whatever you have, you received from here.Â
Whatever you have given, you have given only here.Â

Whatever you took, you took from God.Â

Whatever you gave, you gave to Him.Â
You came empty handed,Â
you will leave empty handed.Â

What is yours today,Â
belonged to someone else yesterday, andÂ
will belong to someone else theÂ
day after tomorrow.Â
You are mistakenly enjoying the thoughtÂ
that this is yours.Â

It is this false happiness that isÂ
the cause of your sorrows.Â

Change is the law of the universe.Â
What you think of as death,Â
is indeed life.Â

In one instance you can beÂ
a millionaire, andÂ
in the other instance you canÂ
be steepedÂ
in poverty.Â

Yours and mine, big & smallÂ
erase these ideas from your mind.Â

Then everything is yours andÂ
you belong to everyone.Â
This body is not yours,Â
neither are you of the body.Â

The body is made of fire, water, air, earth andÂ
ether, and will disappear into these elements.Â
But the soul is permanent -so who are you?Â

Dedicate your being to God.Â
He is the one to be ultimately relied upon.Â
Those who know of his support are foreverÂ
free from fear, worry and sorrow.Â

Whatever you do,Â
do it as a dedication to God.Â
This will bring you theÂ
tremendous experience ofÂ
joy and life-freedom forever.Â

Honestly live to the idealsÂ
Implement the way taught,Â
in your Day to Day Life
Therefore
Be regular in your pursuits.
Be sincere in your studies.
Be heroic enough to live to the postulates.
Don’t blindly believe.
Keep smiling, live every moment with blissÂ

balayogi venkataraman
---------------------------------------------

God within us is the ultimate Guru or teacher. I accept His authority. God within me uses saints like Swamiji to give me knowledge. Ultimately, God within me is the authority and not the mediums which are used by Him. Those mediums don't need to be perfect.

For example, I am clear from within that God does not support discrimination based on caste, birth, gender etc. I cannot set example in front of my daughter to my faith as sexist or biased against women. That does not make sense to me. Any discriminatory statements from any saint or book cannot be accepted by me. I am sure that I am right because God within me telling me.

Swamiji Ramsukhdasji did not accept any disciple. One reason was that he did not claim himself to be perfect. He wanted you to accept your experience and use his teachings as the guide to accept your experience. He was also clear that God is the ultimate teacher and he taught to follow Him.

Does this make sense? Do you still have questions based on above statements?

At His feet in service,
G B

----------------------------------------------------------

In Philosophy we try to know whether a given
statement is TRUE or FALSE.

For example: "Today is Sunday" shall fall in either
of the above category.There is no ambiguity.

Some hold that the *sensory evidence* - like
"An apple has fallen* give us the "truth" of an
event.Science is based on these kinds of evidences.

Question asked by Pilate is in todays parlance would
be termed as *context-sensitive*.

I don't know whether any *context-independent*
"truth" exists or not.

Great - Ludwig Wittgenstein finished his book
"Tractatus Logico Philosophicus* by the statement
-"whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be
silent."

When Mother [Mirra Alfassa] declared that Supermind
[Truth-Consciousness] has descended on Golden
day, Feb29,1956 , it was "truth" to her.

Is this Supermind - Truth [For us] ?
Can we now say after 2000 years of
Jesus's persecution -
SUPERMIND is TRUTH ?

-nilanjan

--------------------------------------------------------

For Marxists, Islamists and Anarchists truth is relative and it has no meaning unless one fall into their trap. Any definition of Truth shall limit its meaning. Many of us have not gone to Magnolia. But can we say that the nation called Magnolia does not exit on this Globe. Correspondence theory of Truth says that if our ideas and concepts corresponds with learned Acharayas and Highly qualified spiritual Masters what they say must be truth. The Math Tecaher says 2 plus 2 is Four. Our Mother says today is your Birthday. Do we have to question or Challenge them.

Only ignorant people will ask us to define Truth. One has to drink milk, or water to have a taste of Milk. can any one define "What is the Taste of MIlk or water? We all know flying. but if some one asks what is Flying? can we conclusively prove or explain what is Flying? Marxist Misfits, Maoist Miscreants, Subversive A agents and Jihadi terrorists are questing us the Veracity of God Krishna's sublime and noble teaching. If one reads it, appreciate it, understand it and follow the spiritual guidelines of Geetha will understand what directions one has to take to achieve liberation and freedom from Misery. Those who wants to create misery will not understand such Truth, digest it or practice it. we cannot change people who act without conscience, behave with out fear, guilt, or remorse. can we change the color of a Tiger, poison from a snake or Scorpion? It is in their nature.

Babu Suseelan

----------------------------------------------------------

know for sure the path to truth is
not straight and simple

we are fortunate enough to
have rishis and saints of high order of satpurush
who actually decoded the path to TRUTH

The Gita,Bible and Sufi terms of
progress to truth are indeed GREEK
to every Sadhak however not to real GURU

please note GITA pathway to Truth is
JAD
CHETAN
JEEV ATMA in heart
Then ABHAS PURUSH
then KUTASTH PURUSH
then SAT PURUSH or VASUDEVA
then DIVYA PURUSH or HARI

similarily Bible reveals
GROSS
SUBTLE AND ASTRAL
HUMAN SOUL
SON OF GOD status
HOLY GHOST status
HOLY FATHER
DIVINE LORD

similarily SUFISM reveals
KASEEF
LATEEF
ALTAAF
LAHUTEE
HUTEE
HAAHUTEE
NOORANI ALLAH

One has to read the Gita and easily
understand this GREEK terminologies
and then advance our way upto
TRUTH.

mugging up may help indirectly
to let guru know one is seroius to
achieve KRISHNA CONCIOUSNESS
however GURU grace and shaktipaat
can work wonders as Lord says in Gita

Oh Arjuna
the TRUTH seeker must
go to an enlightened one
as I shall not always be there
in human form.

so we must know the stages of
spiritual awakening
and seek
SHASHWAT through
ASHISH of a
Satpurush or
GURU or
Swami Jee.

HARI KRISHNA.

"Dr. Puneet Gupta"

--------------------------------------------------

Dear Xavier,

The Buddhist scriptures have two ways of looking at this. One is a tradition
called the 'Chathushkoti'. What is says in essence is that the human mind cannot
comprehend truth. It is limited. So for every verbal statement of 'truth' the
are 4 possible truth states: 1. The statement is truthful 2. It's opposite is
true 3. Neither are true 4. Both are true.

This way of looking at the ideation of our brains frees us from any dogma and
leaves one with an ability to ask questions and observe with wonderment. And
this leads to the second proposition that there is sorrow, and one has to end
sorrow. Idle speculation on questions about the nature of the word, where it
came from and the like, grand philosophical questions are not useful in this
endeavor. There are beautiful stories of the Buddha saying "observe well what I
speak about and what I do not speak about".

Hope this is helpful.

Regards,

Raghu

Equanimity just looks on and observes, while calmly settled in composed
neutrality. It is manifested as the quieting of both resentment and approval.
Gautham Buddha

Raghu Anthanarayanan

----------------------------------------------------------

Namaste
You are correct, mere repeating 'truth' without proper context and issue is nonsense. By the way, Krishna does not talk about 'truth' without elaborating. In Bhagwad Gita his message, among others, was 'karma yoga.' It is a theory or 'hypothesis' if you like. You do not have to believe it or practice it. It is up to you if you are interested. It comes with the assumption that the law of 'Karma', like Newton's third law, works. Whatever you do will come back to you. You have to face the consequences of all your deeds. On the other hand, you neither responsible for the deeds of Adam\Eve, nor you can pass your sins to Jesus. That is you are attached to your own karma. The karma yoga is a way to be free from it. Here is an article attached on the subject.
Thanks, Tilak Shrestha

Tilak Shrestha

----------------------------------------------------------

If truth is context dependent except in science what is the point in repeating the truth ad nauseam without describing the context.
Every time one gets into a debate on any subject someone brings up the word truth which often implies that his argument alone is tenable and that in turn often means he is the last word on the subject.
Hindus say they have the truth, Christians say they have it, Communists say that Marx holds the monopoly to truth and so on.
So is it not better not to use words such as true or truth in a debate unless there is solid evidence to vindicate it as in science?

Xavier William

----------------------------------------------------

Dear Thilak,
You have claimed " Whatever you do will come back to you."
Do you have any scientific evidence in support of your claim?
You have also claimed " ... that the law of 'Karma', like Newton's third law, works" Again you have not provided any evidence for this claim. What is more if law of Karma works why has not the rest of the world adopt the law of karma?
If I say I am the greatest man on earth or that my thoughts are the most sublime on earth I would be branded as an imbecile. But if thousands together claim that we are the greatest people on earth or that out thoughts are the most sublime on earth then we are termed as patriotic.
Just because thousands or millions subscribe to a view or proposition it does not make the view of proposition true. Remember the everyone on earth some 500 years ago said that earth is flat.

Xavier William
----------------------------------------------------------

ONLY HUMAN, ONLY ONLY HUMAN has special gift of God ...VIVEKA. Swamiji has written extensively about it. Swamiji has also written extensively on the fact that a human has birth right to emancipate himself irrespective of any situation, circumstance, caste, creed...etc. He is adviced to read 9th chapter of Holy Gita from sloka no 29 to 33 .

It is in human life only you change your svabhaavs, tendencies, conduct and karma...are you aware of this? Had you been aware of this you would not have equated human life with animals or have given more weightage to animals than humans.

Manoj Srivastava

------------------------------------------------------
Radhey-Krishna

When even the vilest of the sinners can become Dharmatma in KSHIPRAM TIME, as per Gita, what kind of qualifications as pointed out by you can be relevant there?

Read Gita yourself. Read Swamiji yourself. read Scriptures yourself.

any substance other than Truth can only take away you from truth towards deep abyss of ignorance. For instance, Your co relation of sloka 'Svadharma nidhano shreyah..." in your posting in this thread is burning example of the depth at which you are using such pious slokas. You said: FROM SPIRITUAL PERSPECTIVE, THE MOST NATURAL EXPRESSION IS THE BEST - Shreyaan swadharmo viguNah! A "Greek" expression is the most natural to a Greek!!" Unquote..! Now understand what does thisd mean? It means A person is NATURALLY is as he is. An animal is also is naturally as it is. So what? How does that corelate with Svadharma nidhano shreyah? How does that signify or relate with purpose of human life? A human can change his SVABHAAV not a bird or serpent or donkey. Are you aware all yogis of Gita MUST CHANGE / PURIFY/ELIMINATE their egos? If you are as you are , how will you change? Where is then sanctity or value of Scriptures, Saints, Gurus? Where is then difference between a human and an animal?

Sanjay Joshi
----------------------------------------------------------

Raam....!

"What puzzles this alien is the deep-rooted hesitance to acknowledge all sources of knowledge and awareness as Guru amongst the ardent followers of Swamiji. They cannot even spell out Swamiji's name without absolute salutation and respect ... they cannot live without his words for a minute ... yet, hesitance to acknowledge him as Guru!!! But, this alien has no hesitance to invoke its Guru in Swamiji without much ado since it has learnt a lot and has been drawing synergy from all such truth seekers invariably."
Do you know how a devotee meges into the Beloved through Devotion? Devotee does not remain. Only the Beloved remains. There is no server, there is no service, there is only SERVICEE. There is no Bhakta, there is no Bhakti, there is ONLY Bhagwaan. In order to understand this, you must read Swamiji. Had you read Him , the occassion for your non sensical repetitive insistences like : "Chantining his ideas or ideologies that are transmitted through several media such as writings and re-writings do not make a difference to this fellow." or you would not have utterred sentences like : " they cannot live without his words for a minute ..."....where then there remains any need for acknowledging Guru? Did you not ever read Swamiji categorically stating that GURU IS AN ELEMENT? Do you know Swamiji repeatedly told: Accept my teachings, but do not consider me to be Guru,. Do not establish any relationship of Guru-Disciple with me. Do you know? No...you dont know. Why ? Because you never read Him. Are you aware REPEATED CHANTING of Guru's name ( KRISHNAM VANDE JAGADGURUM...KRISHNA's name).

"Of course, the caution covers the possibilities of pretentious wolves who mislead and devour the gullible flocks. The caution is understood and very much appreciated. But this alien does not seem to sympathize with the gullible flocks."

Who are this wolves you are referring to? Are you sure they are not in your mind only and no where else? Who are these flocks you are boasting about?

Finally an advice to you . Read Gita 16th chapter, 18th verse. There is reference of " MAMATMA PARDEHESHU PRADVISHANTOBHYASUYAKAH ". Read, understand and find out traits of people referred in the sloka.

Raam.....!!

Sachin
--------------------------------------------------

JAI SHRI HARI

know for sure the path to TRUTH
is not straight and simple.

we are fortunate enough to
have rishis and saints of high order of satpurush
who actually decoded the path to TRUTH.

The Gita,Bible and Sufi terms of
progress to truth are indeed GREEK
to every Sadhak however not to real GURU.

please note GITA pathway to Truth is
JAD
CHETAN
JEEV ATMA in heart
Then ABHAS PURUSH
then KUTASTH PURUSH
then SAT PURUSH or VASUDEVA
then DIVYA PURUSH or HARI.

similarily Bible reveals
GROSS
SUBTLE AND ASTRAL
HUMAN SOUL
SON OF GOD status
HOLY GHOST status
HOLY FATHER
DIVINE LORD.

similarily SUFISM reveals
KASEEF
LATEEF
ALTAAF
LAHUTEE
HUTEE
HAAHUTEE
NOORANI ALLAH.

One has to read the Gita and easily
understand this GREEK terminologies
and then advance our way upto
TRUTH.

mugging up may help indirectly
to let guru know one is seroius to
achieve KRISHNA CONCIOUSNESS
however GURU grace and shaktipaat
can work wonders as Lord says in Gita.

Oh Arjuna
the TRUTH seeker must
go to an enlightened one
as I shall not always be there
in human form.

so we must know the stages of
spiritual awakening
and seek
SHASHWAT through
ASHISH of a
Satpurush or
GURU or
Swami Jee.

HARI KRISHNA.

"purupuruarchies"

-------------------------------------------------

I agree with you. I had to read with concentration and multiple times before I can understand what you were saying.

I many times ignore your postings because they are hard to understand. I will appreciate if you can write in simpler English.

At His feet in service,
G B

----------------------------------------------

Raam...!

Nice reflections from Naga Narayan. They were overdue and warranted. It is high time, we sprinkle what we call in Hindi...GYAAN KE CHHEENTE !!

Why cant you say that you have merged with the Truth? I will tell you my views...because you retain a like for your mind....!! Telling Swamiji is TRUTH and your reference to truth is reference to Him is correct ONLY so long as what you jabber is Truth...what if what you jabber is 100 percent opposite to His views? This attachment to mind...this only needs to be conquered , if you have AHAM...I am sadhak. If you dont have that Aham....then? Your aim should be "to see certain things in the same manner in which that Great Saint might have possibly seen" (to quote your own words). An effort in this regard should be visible and clear. You, yourself, have sometimes, when in that mode of Gunas, have advocated in beautiful words the importance of STUDENTSHIP. If you simply implement those divine sphuranas, which percolate down through your elaborate writings, your problem gets resolved instantly. What is your problem? Do you know? I will tell you my views...your incapacity to appreciate the FOCUS/AIM of this Divine Forum and an insistence that without reading or referencing too, you can be all knowing. No, you cant. You ought to read at least the question carefully, before you attempt reply !!!

Lastly, one laughing remark. You told a lie in writing to all of us.that.."you seriously lack reading skills"...this is NOT TRUTH....O Advocate of Truth!! Because you write so well, how can you not read so well. Actually your problem is procrastination in Svaadhyaay. If you decide today, first I will read the views of Swamiji in detail, first I will read any Question carefully, First I will read GT Forum Guidelines and then express myself, your problem gets solved then and there. It is a matter of just reading. Do not tell me you can not recognise English alpabets or that language is alien to you. WILLINGNESS TO READ...is missing. Keep contributing...do not let this blame flow on us that we made you do so. Be a brave man !

Raam....!!

Sachin

---------------------------------------------------

Hari Sharanam

The following is divine resolve of Naga Narayanji. " Yet...it is making a sincere attempt to appreciate the ideas and ideologies to its best abilities.". Now also state whether any one of us or we all can point out errors in your expressions or not? So far we believed it was our duty to do so. When you did not appreciate whispers , then shout also came. If you do not want to disrespect the truth, then read...read and read.

Sanjay

-----------------------------------------------------

Naga Narayana,
I am your fan, and I read all your postings carefully. I admire your writing style, though sometimes a bit like Krishnamurty, and I often have to re-read. I look forward to your postings. It is an opener and I am influenced by a few of your views.

girija

-------------------------------------------------------

Swamiji … an alien's appreciation (Part-III: ... on sanctity of human form)

The usefulness and importance of human form to appreciate The Devine actively is never questioned or denied. Swamiji's as well as many scriptures' and saints' revelations on the same is very much appreciated as well. But, it does not mean any other form inferior. I do not expect Swamiji or any other saint to have ever made such claims either. IF AND ONLY IF APPLIED WELL, human form's effectiveness to attain THE TRUTH is beyond doubt. No debate there at all. BUT ...

1. Chanting a saint's claim does not make anyone saintly. The only basis for a truthful seeker is to become THE TRUTH no matter what. Of course, the saint's revelation is sincere and effective. It is self-evident in the saint's core existence as such. Believing in saint's promise certainly provides hope for others. No denial there. But, if the follower takes the saint's revelation for one's own personal claim, the same hope quickly turns superstitious and freezes itself into impenetrable fanatism. Any spiritual seeker's sole responsibility is to identify the same divinity within, apply the same in the right perspective and be The Devine as such. The hope helps only when one is transparently cognizant of one's state without any bias. THEREFORE, THIS ALIEN CANNOT ACCEPT THE PROCLAIMED DIVINITY UNTIL IT ESTABLISHES ITSELF COMPLETELY WITHIN THE SAME.

2. "It should be so because a great man has assured" is very well accepted. But, "I am also so since I accept the great man's revelation" is blindening ignorance indeed. "It should be so" for sure. But, "am I there? how can I get there?" are the right questions to be raised and resolved by a truth seeker rather than insisting the "saint's revelations are the facts". Saint's revelations are the facts for sure ... FOR HIM! Until we absorb the essence and become the same ... they ARE NOT FACTS ... for us.

3. In any case, the statistical evidence remains loud and clear that the human race by and large is neither designed to attain salvation nor is it displaying in symptom of any such kind all through its history. In spite of the divine mechanism vested within, humans act worse than many living forms very consistently all through their so-called evolution. Therefore, for sure, the human race DOES NOT deserve any praise of divinity on its own. The divine humans certainly deserve the praise ... not anyone just because one happens to be with a human form!!! The insistence on the contrary looks like a plot from the ego within which looks for safe asylums all through its existence. More reverential the asylum, stronger its hiding forte ... pretention suits a pride-seeking ego alone, not a truth-seeking wisdom.

Respects.

Naga Narayana.

----------------------------------------------------------

Swamiji … an alien's appreciation (Part-IV: ... on Guru)

The fellow here witnesses a perfect student in Swamiji and hence accepts him as his Guru with no hesitation. In fact, it is the ardent learner in Swamiji and the associated truthfulness that remains an inspiration deep within this fellow that makes him post the revelations thereof in this forum.

One forfeits the rights to learn and hence freedom to seek The Freedom as soon as one slips away from studentship. As soon as one assumes oneself to be a "guru" to anyone else, the very claimant is instantly thrown into the piths of ego and ignorance. As a truthful seeker of The Truth, Swamiji displays an amazingly consistent and acute awareness of this fact. His emphatic requests to his audience NOT TO MAKE him a Guru is in perfect accordance! In fact, that is the quality that inspires the fellow here. Hence the fellow revels his Guru in him.

Has this fellow disrespected in making one who declines the very title of a "guru" as his Guru? NO! Because one's Guru strongly declines the very teacherhood, should the "self proclaimed" student deny the need for a Guru for oneself profusely?? Definitely NO!! Acceptance of a Guru is essential for any to learn. In fact, acceptance of The Guru in everything is ESSENTIAL for a truthful seeker to remain a student ever. Only then all possibilities of believing oneself to be a Guru to someone else is mitigated effectively on one hand; and more importantly, one gets to learn and appreciate the Omnipresent Truth vested in everything on the other hand.

This alien is particularly mesmerized by this universal student's extra-ordinary caution on the pitfalls of institutionalizing "a guru" for one's psychological convenience. Beware of the potential of hiding within ignorance in the name of a "guru". "My guru has told; therefore it is (should be) right!" is the barrier of ignorance that can imprison you within its dungeons forever. Look at the effect: (1) The student never learns; (2) student is NOT student; (3) guru is never considered Guru! Disrespect hides deep within the apparently profound respect!! Beware of the ignorance that gobbles all your appreciation in an instant. Appreciation of THE TRUTH is everyone's individual responsibility. If one tries to escape its wrath under the shades of a pretentious guru, or any other lame reason, one would verily misses a lifetime opportunity.

Of course, the caution covers the possibilities of pretentious wolves who mislead and devour the gullible flocks. The caution is understood and very much appreciated. But this alien does not seem to sympathize with the gullible flocks. The weaklings are born to be weeded out. That is the law of nature. The weaklings are weeded out genetically. So would be the case from spiritual perspective as well. The drama of survival remains perpetual in its stage, the world. But, to this alien, that neither diminishes the value of studentship within and nor does it trivialize the need for The Guru around. In fact both are all the more important to draw synergy from life around and retain vigor within to adopt spirituality in oneself and adapt oneself in THE SPIRIT of all.

What puzzles this alien is the deep-rooted hesitance to acknowledge all sources of knowledge and awareness as Guru amongst the ardent followers of Swamiji. They cannot even spell out Swamiji's name without absolute salutation and respect ... they cannot live without his words for a minute ... yet, hesitance to acknowledge him as Guru!!! But, this alien has no hesitance to invoke its Guru in Swamiji without much ado since it has learnt a lot and has been drawing synergy from all such truth seekers invariably.

This alien DOES NOT see anything wrong in visualizing its Guru in Swamiji or in any other truth seeker as well. In fact, the sole mission of its life is to see THE GURU in EVERYTHING absolutely. Seeking a Guru is not a sin, rather it is essential. Seeking to be a "guru" is THE ONLY SIN one can ever incur ... it pushes the fellow instantly into the dark piths of ignorance. That is the inspiration for this Alien from Swamiji - NEVER BECOME A GURU! REMAIN A STUDENT EVER!! This does not mean "NEVER ACCEPT GURU" to this alien.

This alien is mesmerized by its Guru dancing in Joy in the tides as well as sitting still in the abyss of the ocean of existence that fills, overflows and surrounds the fellow. The Ksheerasaagarashayana - THE ONLY DWELLER OF ALL THIS EXISTENCE (Eeshaavasyamidam sarvam jagatyaam jagat) - remains THE GURU as ever. Anything and everything that inspires the fellow to take a dip in THAT JOY remains its Guru as it cannot distinguish the gate and the abode of THE TRUTH as distinct and different. Swamiji being a consistent inspiration to the fellow remains a great gateway to its Guru as ever. Swamiji having merged within The Truth is automatically The Guru as such to this humbled student's delight as well.

My salutations to THE GURU vested everywhere ... the body ... the mind ... the intelligence ... the wisdom ... THE BLISS that pervades ITS ever-changing existential LABYRINTHS revealed all around as well as ITS never-changing transcendental ABYSS presiding deep within.

Respects.

Naga Narayana.

---------------------------------------------------------

The truth is shashwat
that always prevails as such
without a change

however on way to this powerful kingdom of truth
the little electical bulb of self
can not glow if attached directly to generator
or thick transmiiting wire,
it alone can lighten up and survives if attached to
a thin electrical wire,

so is the self aware person
of atam saakshaatkaar level
cannot attach to generator or
GOD or Divya Prabhu directly
only an enlightened GURU like SWAMI JEE can
as Geeta reveals
purush
then uttam purush
then satpurush or vasudeva alone
can have darshan of
HARI or divya Prabhu
the TRUTH or SANATAN

not those with atam saashtakaar level
or NON SWAMI JEE level

SATYA MEV JAYATE

JAI HARI KRISHNA
JAI GURUDEV
JAI ATAM PRAKASH

"Dr. Puneet Gupta"

-------------------------------------------

Vande Maatram

Thanks Nagaji for coming out of your shell of writing, writing and writing. You are versatile and hence sometime should be devoted to reading also. You said " I see Swamiji as the Truth" . You also said : " Until I resolve all the conflicts with the truth from within, you can not say you have merged with the Truth"....excellent. Very honest and genuine observation. That is where we stand as of date. This is Satsanga Forum, its aim is helping you come out of such conflicts only. Obviously , the aim of your life is not to become some Guru, it can only be to realise the Truth. Hence the best answer to your problem as summarised above is....Ask Questions to this Forum rather than answering, narrating as to what are those "conflicts with the Truth" , you are encountering ? Some soul will give you answer, now that you have confirmed: " Therefore..when I do not "see" what others "see" or what Swamiji "sees", it DOES NOT MEAN I do not appreciate what I could not see" !! But you made one error : Read the next sentence: " Synchronising MY vision with MY appreciation is the true seeking to me". Here, MY word is wrong, replace it by His vision and continue with MY appreciation. Else you will never come out of present, not very satisfactory, state. STUDENT means "following others" not one self. Your emancipation takes place, for example, when you follow Scriptures (others). You have to follow the vision (views/ seeings) of Swamiji with your appreciation....not your own vision with your own appreciation...that a non human or average human often does. But we are Sadhaks.

Ashish Dhawan

----------------------------------------------

Narayana, you have a brilliant mind. Bina G K

------------------------------------------------

Radhey_Krishna

Congratulations Nagaji for totally honest expressions by you, if not strictly truthful. This is what is needed. I am one of the "followers" of Swamiji in the group and hence also the target of you. Neither you nor me nor any one else can EVER disrespect Swamiji, He is beyond such things. Your message is very timely. We, if we are really "followers" of Swamiji, then should not express "anguish or anger" at you or should not "come over and beat the heck" out of you , that is job of Mother Nature and Paramatma, not ours, but we can definitely give a tip or two now that you have given us honestly the reasons of your controversial jabberrings/utterrings or expressions.

I wonder if you are aware even , that your writings are mostly NOT TRUTHFUL, EVEN when we equate Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj with Truth. So long as you do not refer to His writings and views, but so long as you by your intentions are reflecting the same views, you are perfectly alright. But that is not the case. On all important issues, you write contrary to Him, out and out contrary to Him. How many dozen instances I should bring out? Why do I wonder here? Because you dont even read Him, inspite of Moderators making His statements at the top of thread. Where is the Question of echoing same sentiments, when you have not even read Him ? Thus, you can not claim that since you are TRUTH Ful , hence you are respecting Swamiji's views, because Truth and Swamiji are one and the samething.It is only when some one whispers and then shouts that you wake up. For example consider again your jabber: "Emphatic display of one's loyalty to the Truth is meaningless ...sometimes even harmful." But what , when some emphasises to the contrary (false) and keep doing it ? Which is more harmful? Why you should look at "insistence over Truth" as harmful? What harms can it cause once it is stuck like a fevicol with Truth? Why are we here on this Forum? Frankly...to insist on Truth only. Why else?

But certainly , you are innocent and honest. I have read you for long, and I can give reasons , solid reasons, to prove that you are honest in your utterrings. Your problem is over confidence and NOT READING AT ALL, even the Question , what to talk of Swamiji !!! You are honest when you state: " When an alien such as this fellow does not see truth....". But then that exactly what is concern for all of us. That is why we are here on this Forum. That makes us SHOUT. Genuinely, so. Ask now even a child...he will you...Read Swamiji...before you write. You will become different , then and there.

Mohit Desai

-------------------------------------------------

Namaste

Nagaji ! I am sure "certain sector of Swamiji's followers in the group"---includes your truly also. I love your this posting's jabbers. You must thank this Forum for forcing upon you certain very honest truths. One of them is - You write against the views of Swamiji regularly without even reading Him and thereby you cause a huge dis comfort in all of us, particularly when all regulars are expected to get first attuned to the object of this Forum. You cant however whisk away by telling: You are not a skilled reader and have no ability to learn any new languages. Your existing language is good enough, and can make us all proud of this Forum provided you first read and then write. In your "sincere attempts to appreciate the ideas and ideologies" , the first essential requirement is READING. It is VERY VERY clear without even your this confession, that you do not read even the Question carefully. That is very bad. If you are short of time, the time you spend on writing , reduce it to half, does not matter whether we all get half page only of your wisdom instead of one full plate, and spend time saved in reading. Simple solution.

Believe me, you are a great asset to this Forum , if you first read and then write. That will also remove the need for you to later on read our responses and re-act. You are very good at some places, but very very insistent, one sided and over confident. You are under umbrella of Param Shraddheya Swamiji , Dear ! Here only truth must prevail. Nothing else except Truth.

This is how Satsanga helps.

Manoj Srivastava

------------------------------------------
Dear Naga Narayana -The Alien ?,
Perhaps only ALIENS can understand and appreciate whatever you have tried to pontificate...Please
Save it for the alien community...people living in the outer space... ! !
Yogesh Lajmi.
GOOD LUCK !

---------------------------------------------------------

I as a sincere follower of Bhagavad Gita and its content cannot appreciate the story about Bheema throwing his mace (gada) up and standing right below it and Lord holding at safe for Bheema. This contradicts the every essence of Gita. Daivam enters the picture only when the first four factors - adhiShTAnam, karaNam, karta and prithak cEShTa, are ready and involved in the action. If bheema has thrown the mace up, it is gada's duty to fall down on any onject in its downward path. Paramaatma does not obstruct the natural phenomenon, as it amounts to obstructing a nd sidestepping Rita. I totally agree with Bheema's argument about Krishna being with us always. But the illustration sends a negative message.

Paandavas not given to morning bhajans. they went about their chores unhindered and did their job as BHAJAN or POOJA. Please read 11. 41, 42 of Gita. It is clear from these that Pandavas, particularly Arjuna treated Krishna as a dear friend and joked with him, addressed him on equal terms (no Krishnaji). This precludes the claimed bhajans. Only Kunti treated Krishna as the most superior Being. She did Bhaja Krishna on more than one occasion. Draupadi was more sisterly. Bharata is a saga of human struggle in which Krishna preferred to play the role of avery shrewd human
With lots of regard to the swami (ji) whom I do not know
Samudrala Krishna
-----------------------------------------------

Radhey ! Radhey !!

I have no hesitation in stating that I am "follower" of Swamiji. Actually, this
Forum is dedicated to Him and to His teachings only. Yes...I have huge issues,
not with your contrary views (every person is entitled to hold a contrary
view...it is fundamental right of a contributor) , but I have issues pertaining
to your TOTAL AND COMPLETE non appreciation of even the very object of this
Forum, to your TOTAL AND COMPLETE ignorance even of the Q which you are
attempting to answer and your TOTAL AND COMPLETE insistence , and of course
incomprehensibility. Nagaji...I have no doubt, you are honest. Certainly, you
dont echo Truth, because Truth is not a belief or something which can be dubbed
as arising from within. You have your own flashes of brilliance, but so does
every single soul on this planet, being fragment of Parameshwar, but how does
that help you? There is huge ego in you, regarding whatever you like. There is
only insistence and nothing else, not
even any sentiment, in your utterrings. They are not visible to you, but we can
see that clearly. We dont have any problem in that except one. Our goal is to
let the world know about the extra ordinary vision of Swamiji Ramsukhdasji
Maharaj for welfare of humanity at large. Few years back we had hardly 7/8
thousand members, today we have nearly 28000. We answer here Qs of people based
on Swamiji and Gita. Now for so many years, we have not been able to cure even
you, what does that mean? But how can we cure you, if you dont even read? Up to
here also, does not matter. But you keep writing continuously just opposite of
what Swamiji or Gita says. It is not that you do not read, but you read
reactions of us. Just convert that reading to the Scriptures and Swamiji's
messages, the very need to read reactions will go away. So you know how to read,
but you have no inclination to read. WHY ? My answer is: Absolute blind ego ! It
is ego in you that whatever you
say is right...that has blinded you completely to TRUTH. You believe that
Scriptures arise from within, I also believe so. But when ? When you have
strived first and conquered outer sheaths like ego, intellect, body etc. You are
struggling with yourself today. Nothing to get ashamed on that. We all struggle.
But you should have flexibility of appreciating other's vision rather that
always utterring...ME ME MY MY ..my vision, my appreciation etc. You should
develop habit of getting up early in the morning and doing SVAADHYAAY. Reading
should be your habit, not writing. First fill in your mind with knowledge and
then spread it for benefit of us all. You cant say: I lack reading skills. You
are TOTALLY AGAINST TRUTH there. It is a false statement.

Radhey ! Radhey !!

Nisha Chatterji

----------------------------------------------------------

Shri Hari

Actually when one knows that crowd is Hindi knowing, then one should not jabber in Greek at all. Even God takes AVATAAR , viz comes down from elevated position to lower state of a human and speaks in that language only which humans can understand. Parents also talk in broken language of child. Why then, Naga Babu, you speak Greek? In any case, entire paragraph, is as usual totally irrelevant because you and we all are communicating in English !

Central theme of your special message is that so long as you jabber TRUTH, you are echoing Swamiji, who you have rightly described as TRUTH. But that will be possible only when what you echo (jabber in your special English) is same as what that Great Saint has stated. Is it so? No, it is not so. You do not know, but we know because we read both. You read yourself only, not Swamiji or Scriptures or even the Question fully. This is FACT. This is TRUTH.

Satsanga means "association with Truth". It is duty of all of us to bring out truth only. Hence so long as you will keep speaking what is not Truth, the "followers" of Swamiji will keep reminding you that you are not right. That is Satsanga. Actually, you should be thankful to those who point out your faults to you.

No body is against you. No body minds contrary views also, so long any reasons are given or references of Scriptures are given. You should be grateful to Moderators who have supported your writings throughout, which in no other Forum would have done. There has to be some substance, something to say. If there can be any award anyewhere to that person, who has capacity of writing continuously without conveying any meaning at all, you shall be the receiver of the same.This Forum has taken comically , the majority of your messages, but when you speak out and out against Revered Swamiji, how can that Forum which is DEDICATED EXCLUSIVELY TO HIM and Holy Gita remain silent? Any way, as Nishaji said: DER AAYAD, DURAST AAYAD, now kindly devote sometime to reading Gita, Swamiji and Scriptures also. It will help you out of your present mode.

Pranaams

Ankuur

--------------------------------------------------

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[gita-talk] Re: On Samdarshi and Samvarti

 

Jai Sri Radhe
According to Gita, one should look at all people with the attitude of equanimity but not behave the same with all. I want to know why Lord Rama ate the fruits offered by Shabari who was from a low cast? If I eat with my Sudra (low caste) friends, I will have a problem. (If we assume that the same God resides in all then why should there be a difference?)

Another question--
Can we allow Muslems in Hindu Temple? If yes, why? If not, why not?

Satyaranjan Bhuyan

---------------------------------------------

IN HINDI
Jai Sri Radhe, Gita ke anusar manushya "SAMADARSHI"hona
chahiye,SAMABARTI nahin.To prabhu Ramchandra ne Sabari se kiyon nuts
khaye ?Main janna chahata hun ki Samabarti ho kar yadi main mere sudra
friends ke sath khana khaun to kya problem hoga (sab ke antar me to
bhagwan ke bas hai to ye vedbhaw kiyon)?Auq ek questn-(hindu mandir
main hum kya muslimon ko allow kar sakte hain.yadi haan to kiyun and
yadi naa to kiyun )

Satyaranjan Bhuyan

===============================================

Dear Sadaks,
Please reply to my question to get answer to Samadharshani.
1) Why did Sri Rama kill Ravana, Vaali? In them there was Narayana.
2) Why did Sri Krishna disliked Duryodhan (Which can be seen at part of war, when Duryodhan was called out from water)?
If you follow 2 routes you end up NO where. If you follow 2 religions it is same.
The problem of eating with low caste friend is in you- NOT in him. If you recognition that same paramathuma is in your friend, you will have NO thought that he is low caste. Once you remove from Buddhi and Manus, then you are one in this universe with GOD.
B.Sathya

===========================================

Hari Om

Views of Param Shraddheya Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj on the subject:

Equanimity (of Holy Gita) does not mean that you conduct equally with all humans, particularly when it is a question of food and marriage etc. EQUANIMITY IN CONDUCT (samvartinah) IS A GREAT CAUSE OF YOUR DOWNFALL. Hence "equal conduct" is the name of Yamraaja, the name of death, because in the conduct of Yamraaja there is no inequality. When you keep hygiene in conduct , your antahkarana (mind, intellect, ego and Chitta- inner senses) becomes pure and faultless. But when you keep impurity in conduct , by making food , marriage etc one, there arises impurity and thereby lack of peace. Keeping only outer conduct same, is against the Scriptures and Societal norms and limits( maryaada). Such equal conduct ( samvartinah) causes struggle in societies....Sadhak Sanjeevani ...BG 5:18

While commenting on BG 7:30, the Great Holy Saint went on to state :

From the point of view of Jagat, Jeeva and Paramatma, we all are one. To this equanimity , Gita calls YOGA. Division/distinction (bheda) is only for conduct (samvartinah) ( and not for viewing- samdarshina), because IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO REMAIN EQUAL IN CONDUCT (vyavhaar). Therefore, a Sadhak should have equanimity in Bhaavana/ drishti ( sentiment/vision). The difference in conduct is NATURAL, but the difference in bhavas/sentiments is human creation through likes and dislikes.

Swamiji always made distinction between "doing" and "viewing" ...Sadhaks should read Him on Vasudev SARVAM ( BG 7:19) also.

Precisely therefore, the terms" SAMVARTINAH " and " SAMDARSHINA" can NEVER NEVER be meaning same and simply CAN NOT be used for each other. Gita is too scientific a Scripture to permit such interchangeability. Swamiji would often distinguish the two scenarios by stating that you don't drink milk of bitch rather drink milk of cow, you do not ride on dog, you ride on elephant, you do not worship a chandal, you worship a Brahmin ( taking all examples given in BG 5:18 - Brahmin, Cow, Dog, Chaandal , Elephant etc) to explain fundamental difference between Samvartinah and Samdarshina.

Yes...it is a fact that the untouchability was practiced in 18 th and 19 th centuries in India excessively and hence even people like Gandhiji would resist that. But that does not mean the basis beneath that practice was faulty or detestable. Basis was the EVER EXISTING difference between the terms " SAMDARSHINA" and " SAMVARTINAH" ! This difference can never be equated or negated. In olden days also of untouchability era, who would take bath? If a Brahmin touches Shudra , then whether Brahmin would take a bath or Shudra? Who would suffer austerity ? Hence, Sanatan Dharma has solid roots for everything. Practice is human, may change with times, can be faulty also, but the concept and theme is always SANATAN (eternal/never changing).

Certainly, Hindu Dharma does not permit any disparity of caste, creed, colour etc. It is only practice by humanity which can be faulted with, not the concept/theme. Swamiji Himself would distinguish when it came to BHIKSHA ( He would eat food fetched from 5 homes). Why Lord Rama ate the berries of Shabri ? Because a Bhakta is NEVER a caste, or creed or colour or gender or body. Bhakta (Sadhak) is always a BHAVA , AN UNMANIFEST , not a body. Who gets God? Not Brahmin, nor Kshatriyas nor Vaishya nor Shudra nor an ascetic nor a householder...only Bhakta gets God...not any other. There can be no bar in any human visiting any temple or mosque. Sanatan Dharma does not approve of this. Practice may be faulty, but not the law.

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

--------------------------------------------------

Om, Lord Ram, maryada Purushottam, never in His life did He discriminate. This disease of "jaati" was brought about by foreign invasions, and cause much harm to our Country.

IN HINDI

OM. BHAGVAN RAM MARYADA PURUSHOTTAM THE, UNHONE JIVAN ME KABHI BHI BHEDBHAV NAHI KIYA YE JATIGAT BHEDBHAV KA ROG TO VIDESHI AKRAMKON NE LAYA AUR HAMARE DESH NE ISKA BAHUT NUKSAN UTHAYA.
.
Dr. V. D. Sharma

----------------------------------------------------

Hare Krishna

I agree with Sadhak GB and Basudeb Sen. Ramsukhdasji Maharaj spoke extensively on the subject of samata (equanimity) and distinguished between the terms SAMVARTINA and SAMDARSHINA used in Holy Gita. He , giving unimpeachable arguments, stated that you can never be equal in behaviour with all, but you can be equal in vision for all. In behaviour, it is impossible to be equal. Swamiji would say that only the God of Death- Yamraaj- can be SAMVARTINA not any body else, however he may be. He said: To be SAMVARTINA is degradation and defined the term YOGA used in Gita to be SAMDARSHINA not samvartina. The distinction of food, marriage ,dress, language etc is representative of SANSKRITI and each human is duty bound to protect what he has inherited. The practice of untouchability might have reached extreme heights in the past, it might have been quite horrible also, but the fact still remains that entire Sanatan Dharma is based on SVE SVE KARMANYARABHIRATAH SANSIDDHIM LABHATE NARAH.. Gita 18:45. There is a meaning of the word DVIJA ( Loosely termed Brahmin ) in Scriptures . There are duties given to all based on their NATURAL svabhaavs and Gunas.Upto here it was a talk of BEHAVIOUR. But THERE ARE NO DISTINCTIONS OF ANY DUTIES, CASTE ETC MADE BY PARAMATMA IN YOUR RIGHT TO ATTAIN GOD REALISATION. Each human is entitled, fully capable and ever complete in that respect. No one is deficient, no one is ineligible, no one is higher, no one is lower. All are EQUAL...ALL ARE ONE, ALL ARE SAME.....That is Sanatan Dharma.

Shabri was a sadhak not any female or shudra or brahmin. A sadhak is always a bhava shareer, never of any caste etc. Hence Lord Rama ate the food offered by her.

This world is a manifestation of Paramatma only. Hence, from one point of view, entire world is temple only. That a practice existed in the past somewhere of not permitting some one to enter was merely a defective human practice, a defective implementation. Now, in India also where is such practice? Why are we still criticising about a thing which some one some time might have practiced somewhere? That way as Sadhak GB pointed out , such practice is prevalent in US at present also, there the distinction is between blacks and whites instead of Brahmins and Shudras. That is no difference actually. To be hygeinic is no crime, IT IS NEED. Maharajji also would distinguish on the issues of food and marriage etc. For example, He would not accept BHIKSHA from the home of that family where any abortion has taken place. Why should He? How else He would insist on others NOT TO indulge in heinous crimes such as abortion. But when a pious lady, sought the penance and insisted that He should take BHIKSHA from her home, Swamiji asked her to do NAAM JAPA (daily 0ne lac names) for one year, and when she did that, He accepted BHIKSHA from her home !!!!

Pranaams to all Sadhaks on this Divine Forum. May this Forum live long.

Abhishek

--------------------------------------------------

Radhey Krishna

It is IMPOSSIBLE to equate behaviour and conduct with all. Example: A difference in conduct with wife and with mother. Samvartina put there would mean total degradation and downfall of very humanity. Samata means your DRISHTI should be equal not behaviour. Any suggestion that the words samvartina and samdarshina are complimentary to each other, and unless samdarshina is accompanied by samvartina , the same becomes meaningless, is absolutely wrong and a fragment of an ignorant perception only of Gita and Scriptures.

Sanjay


--------------------------------------------------

Hari Sharanam

The questioner is right that Gita wants each of us to be samdarshi and not samvartina. You can be equal with all in behaviour, that is impossible. Gita would never use words casually or loosely. It is the most holy scripture of Hindu Dharma. Any possibility of it requiring any changes is ruled out. The entire Gita is based on SAMATA (equanimity) and that equanimity is NOT SAMVARTINA but SAMDARSHINA. There is a huge, irreconciliable difference between these two words. There is no possibility or need of reading these two terms as one and the same. They can never be the same.

Raina S

-------------------------------------------------------

Shri Hari

Sanatan Dharma is for every human, of every caste, creed , country, culture, color and for every such distinction. In Sanatan Dharma Scriptures, the Gita is crown jewel. It has no barriers, it is for all. Upanishads may be for eligibles only, but Gita is FOR ALL. Gita has been spoken by Lord for ENTIRE HUMANITY. Each human is eligible EQUALLY for emancipation. There is no distinction there as rightly pointed out by GB. When Gita distinguishes between samvartina and samdarshittva, that distinction is FINAL, irrefutable and perfect. Maharajji spoke at length on this subject. He would always advocate that Equanimity or Yoga is the name of SAMDARSHITTVA and can not be of samvartinattwa. Except, YAMRAAJA, said Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj in a pravachan, no other can be SAMVARTINA. Every human gets few things by birth. These are called Svabhaavs, Gunas and Sanskriti. You have to behave in accordance therewith only. Your Sanskriti is reflected by your food, dress, marriage, occupation and dialect. On these issues, there is bound to be distinction and rightly so. Equanimity does not mean you eat together or dress similarly or marry . They become equal in purpose of human life viz Liberation or God Realisation but NEVER before in day to day conduct or behaviour. Hence behaviour of all to all is bound to be distinct, but the vision ought to be the same. For example, you may not behave with your sister or neighbour's wife the same way as you do with your wife, but you can see them equally as children of same God who is your Father also. Hence it is not a correct observation to state that Samdarshittwa is empty without samvartintwa or vice versa . There is difference between these two words and Gita has rightly used the word SAMDARSHINA in 5:18 and Gita 's Yoga also is that samdarshinttwa only NOT samvartinttwa.

Namaste

Ankuur

There have been few excesses practiced in the past centuries in India in the name of caste divisions. But they were faults of practitioners and not of Scriptures like Gita.

-----------------------------------------------------

Radhey ! Radhey !!

First reply to Dear Humble Saadhak. Sir, for ber also there is jaati. There is
nothing in this universe which is not divided into 4 divisions of caste. All
creatures, vegetables are segregated into 4 divisions. For example a pigeon is
Brahmin, a baaj is Kshtriya, a crow is vaishya and so on...!

No...! To conduct equally (behaviour) is not at all the message of Holy Gita be
it verse 5;18 0r SAMATA. Gita wants you to be samdarshina and NEVER samvartina.
Read Swamiji Maharaj on the subject. Read commentary by Him in Gita Prabodhini
under the verse 5:18. All such confusions will go away.

Radhey ! Radhey !!

Nisha Chatterji

--------------------------------------------------

God does not use mankind laws? And he is above all? He can do whatever he wants, He has no RULES? Why is this not a basic principle of Live? This is too easy and it is sad that this question is asked? from India, the world, the Western world is different. People from India have a different mentality, so that is why this question came up. For the west? It is not a question for discussion. Coming from India and having this convoluted outlook on life, is surprising? Again God is above man's law and can do whatever he/she wants and who can feed god so he will et sick, or try to hurt him/her by giving something bad to eat? THINK?
Second Question: Muslim in Hindu Temple? First response? WHY NOT? A western response: All worshipping Building are Public access, whic means
ANYONE can come into any Temple, Mosque, Church, or Synagogue. Again, as I experience people from India, their outlook on life is totally different, since they interpret the Vedas to make the caste system having the Brahamins to be high class, (which is totally BS) They intrepret the vadas, in a way that is so wrong and foolish? Creating 3 millions for the other caste to practice, and to go so far as to sell their own people to the white as slaves. In a way coming from another made us different from the Indians from India. And most of them do not consider us Indians. All other Race embrace their brothers and sisters borned in other coutries as their own, BUT not Indians from India as I see them here on this forum and in reality in America?
So when it comes to discuss topics of interest about Hinduism, it is a joke to see the Doctors and Phds and All learned men asking such foolish and basic questions. It is to show how they are child like and once sided and treat the rest of the world as inferior? When it reality they are the ones? Where is India when compared with the rest of the world. Yes I know they said they will be a super power? Will you be around to see this?
I am done?

Gupchand Badri

----------------------------------

Can we allow Muslems in Hindu Temple? If yes, why? If not, why not?

YES! If you want to expand your community and communal harmony.
NO! If you want to isolate your identity and enjoy a kind of dignity in such isolation.

"Allowing" any to a "Temple" is absolutely irrelevant if you seek The Truth thruthfully. There is nothing other than temple anywhere; the whole universe is one such temple. There is none other than The God; who is allowing whom becomes absolutely redundant then.

Respects.

Naga Narayana.

---------------------------------------------

You asked: why Lord Rama ate the fruits offered by Shabari who was from a low caste?
Saadhaka's reply : ber phal hai. phal kee jaati, achchhaa yaa kharaab hotee hai NAA ki brahman, kshatriya, vaishya yaa shoodra yaa high or low. Raam ne ber khaaye, naa ki Shabareese vyavahaar (maan - betaa kaa yaa betee - pitaa kaa) banaayaa.
You asked : Can we allow Muslems in Hindu Temple? If yes, why? If not, why not?
Saadhaka's reply : yadi kisee poojaa sthal ko aap Hindu Temple kahate hain to koee musalamaan bhalaa usamen jaayegaa hee kyon? Kyaa masjid men aap jaate hain? is prashnako poochhaneke pahale kripayaa apane gharamen poochhiye ki kitane sadasya masjidmen nawaaj padhane jaayenge? is sanvedanasheel prashnako Muslim Samaajake forum men poochh kar dekhiye. tab samajh jaayenge.
Humbly,
Saadhaka

---------------------------------------------------

I don't know why these questions get posted on Gita-Talk again.

US law forbids any discrimination at job based on religion, ethnicity, race, caste, color of skin, gender and sexual orientation.

I agree with it. I also strongly believe that Hindu religion also does not allow any sort of such discrimination in pursuing God, in choosing livelihood (job) etc.

I was seeing TV show and saw that white won't share same plates which were used by blacks. They will set aside separate utensils for blacks if they were eating with them. My immediate reaction was how degraded such practice is.

Then, I remember that we will do the same in our family. Their will be separate cups and plates for maid-servant. I couldn't imagine how my family could discriminate like that. How these poor people tolerate such discrimination every day? At that time, it felt so normal. I did not see much wrong with it.

I pray to God that he give intelligence to people of India (like my family) and stop such discrimination. These are good people but unfortunately engage in such degrading behavior.

At His feet in service,
G B

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Samadrashana is meaningless without Samavartana ...

Treating all as equal is much more important than understanding that all are equal. Unless knowledge percolates into one's action completely, it remains incomplete to that extent.

Samadarshana is a pre-requisite condition for Samavartana. But if Samadarshana does not merge into Samavartana, it looses its significance completely! Worse, it may become an egotic knot for the seeker as such!!

Eating with your "Shudra" friend is not sin at all. Considering him/her as Shudra while not considering your self as one IS SIN for sure! Everyone is born as Shudra and remains one in one's base existence. Shudrattva can never be eliminated. What one can ever do is to refine the character with fears, desires and knowledge as one grows with life. It is the appreciation of life that creates a painting on the blank sheet called "Shudrattva" everyone is born with. The paintings cannot deny the existence of the blank sheet. So is the Shudrattva. Therefore, ignoring that reality knowingly is the biggest blunder of all. Ignoring that reality unknowingly does not make any better either.

One of my Ph.D. student and his doctor wife were labelled SC. My orthodox mother (grand daughter of a Dikshit, daughter of an Avadhani, wife of a Shastry) was shocked when the couple were invited to our home for dinner one day. I explained to her how the two are much more than mere "shudras" and how they are better than most "Brahmins" she knows. My mother grew out of her "Shudrabhaava". The doctor became one of the best friends to my mother in no time!

Dogs, cows and donkeys were regular visitors to my Guru's living space. They sat amongst the so-called "human" audience and received the same love, affection and respect (probably more due to their innocence) that the humans received. They got the same food as the humans. They got the petting from The Avadhuta that many humans missed due to their arrogance and ignorance!!!

Vidyaa vinaya sampanne brahmane gavi hastini |
Shuni chaiva shvapaake cha paNDitaah samadarshinaah || 5.18 ||

I do not hesitate to dare repeat the same and end as "Gnyaanayah samavartinaah", "Yogayah samavartinaah" as well as "Bhaktaastu samavartinaa hi".

Samavartana COMPLETES the Samadarshittva. The later remains empty unless the former fills it. In a way, the later remains a "Shudra" untill the former fills it!!!

Therefore, do not hesitate to acknowledge yourself in any other being ... not just in a Shudra ... not just in the fellow animals ... not just in the fellow living beings including plants ... even in the dust particles as well as in the whole universe ...
But ... it is very much appreciable that each being has its own zone of tolerance and bandwidth of relaxation ... if you are pained within ... intrigued within ... pause ... do not do anything that pains you within or intrigues you within or makes you feel guilty or filthy within ... Na buddhibhedam janayet ... and think what were your barriers ... try whether you can break the same ... keep challenging the barriers ... THAT IS SADHANA TO ME.

Respects.

Naga Narayana.

----------------------------------------------------------

1. There is no bar of taking/eating food from the hands of anyone provided
one knows/ trusts the hands are clean, the food offered is safe, the person
offering the food is offering the food with love in the heart and not just
to please you for some benefit expected from you, the offerer did not gather
the food by unfair means, you need the food, you would like the food and/ or
you do not just want not to make his sad by refusing to take. Judgement is
yours. Gita does not bar you from taking your decision in this regard but
wants to take responsibility of making judgement and not blame Gita later
on.
The restrictions on taking food from others are often based on social and
reliugious customes prevailing at different periods of time. But such
restrictions have nothing to with spirituality. Sanyasis beg to gather their
food - beggars are not choosers but they must excercise catioun that the
food is what they like and safe to eat before eating the food.
2. As per Gita, all are equal and God is in everything and everyone. Those
who believe in this Truth, will not stop anyone from entering a place of
worship. A temple is a place of worship and not for fun or other purposes.
If a mulim wants to pay reverence to the temple's assumed dweller Hindu God
or merely wants to have a feel of the environment in the temple, why should
one object to a muslims entry to the temple. After all, for Gita's dharma
all human beings are the same: different manifestations of the same God,
irrespective of wealth, religion, income, colour, health, profession,
morality, integrity etc. But no one will allow entry to one own home or
Temple, a person likely to create problems of violence of disrupt worship
activity of the devotees in the temple.

Basudeb Sen

----------------------------------------------------

Dear Sadhaks
People are people. Caste is only a social identity. Any food that is hygienic and bereft of any kind of violence is fine. All the excretions of human body can be highly infectious. Saliva is good only for self. Even if one is a "brahman". That is the limitation of human body. More over as discussed earlier in this satsang, this body is made to consume only fruits. We violate this information left right and centre. That is why, probably anything that comes out after being processed inside the body is so infectious. Shabari lived on fruits. She lived a perfect human life. She offered her perfection to Rama and attained liberation.
Humbly
Veena

-------------------------------------------------

Dear Mr.Satyaranjan Bhuyan,
Hinduism is neither a Religion NOR a Dogma...it is "A way of Life"...!
Yogesh Lajmi.

-----------------------------------------------------

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Sunday, July 22, 2012

[gita-talk] Re: Few Thoughts on Swamiji's Punaya Tithi - July 3, 2005

 

Shree Hari
Ram Ram

According to English Calendar, seven years ago on July 3rd, 2005, SWAMIJI became the jewel in Lord's crown. (Bhagwaan ke mukkat - mani) . Swamiji remains alive in our hearts through his immortal teachings. Swamiji once said - The best service (Param Seva) to a saint is to live your life as per his principles and thus become like him. We all can offer this PARAM SEVA to Swamiji and humanity at large. Let us join forces in this divine work of God!

Let us live our lives in accordance with the principles laid down in the Gita and ensure that they never die. Increasing awareness of Gita and Gita press books was one of his eternal aspirations. Let us commit ourselve to regular reading of Gita and to live by it's principles.

Those who have not read, it is strongly justed to read Swamiji's Thoughts and His Will !

Swamiji's Thoughts
http://www.swamiramsukhdasji.net/AboutSwamiji/My-Thoughts.pdf

Swamiji's Will -
http://www.swamiramsukhdasji.net/AboutSwamiji/A-Humble-Request-A-Will.pdf

Sarve Bhavantu Sukhinah !

Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram
Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram

From Gita Talk Moderators

=====================================================

Namaste

The views of Swamiji on the topic of Guru are abundantly clear. There is no need in a human life of any Guru at all. Guru is living within every human being as a birth right. Not only Swamiji , but entire Sanatan Dharma Scriptures are unanimous on one front: Guru is an element and not a person. Hindus NEVER BELIEVE IN IDOL WORSHIP. To worship or glorify Guru was hugely protested by Swamiji. Swamiji was very eloquent on ghastly sins like abortions, family planning, etc. His views on the subject are so extra ordinary that when you read them , you can only feel speechless. His favourite recommendation was SERVE COWS. He used to say : Today on Hindus and Cows, there is huge calamity.

Swamiji was totally determined regarding KANCHAN (money) and KAAMINI ( woman). His pravachans paandals used to be poles apart from today's so called fake Gurus' paandaals. He would never allow females to raise their hands even in Keertan times, no one would be allowed to clap, no one would be allowed to touch His feet, or do jai jai kaar. In pin drop silence and unbelievable decorum, He would roar. I remember , one day in J B Nagar, Andheri, Mumbai, He immediately after His night pravachan, asked all to disperse. That day, I distinctly, remember there was no long and usual keertan session
also. No body noticed that , but within minutes of every body leaving the paandal, it caught fire due to unknown reasons. Not a single soul got hurt. I distinctly remember that day. Imagine , what would have happened , had fire taken place with more than 20000 people in the paandal !!! He was an enigma.

His roaring voice...SAJJANO (gentlemen) , still echoes in my mind. He would say : You are my food giver. He would address listeners as KRIPAA NIDHAAN, KRIPAA KARO ! On abortions and family planning now in full practice in India, He would rue and say regretfully: From where Saints and Mahatmas will come on this earth, if mothers and sisters indulge in such sins? Where will we take birth? He was very bitter for sinners of abortions, etc. He would say : Please, do not offer BHIKSHA to me, if in your home some body has committed this sin. Females used to cry after His pravachans on this subject. Many used to write to Him: Now what we should do? Swamiji would say: Do Naam Japa , minimum minimum minimum one lac God's name every day.

On wit front, He once went for BHIKSHA, in a home. The lady asked Him: KHICHADI DOON , YAA ROTI ? The Great Saint replied: Give Khichadi over the Roti. ( Give Khichadi and Roti both). In pravachan, He said to Listeners: You are greater than me, because you are free to come or not come , but I am bound to come here at the appointed time !!!

Raina S

----------------------------------------------------

Shree Krishna

Shraddheya Swamiji has no recent parallel in His Works. While Swamiji would often say that Sharananandji was the most intelligent person , He ever came across, but I simply used to marvel at Maharajji's wit and sharp intellect. His simple simple formulae , which He gave to the humanity at large, like Hey Naath...Main Apko Bhulu Nahin, Chup Saadhan, Karan Nirapeksha Sadhans, the theory of Sveekruti (acceptance) are novel, innovative and revolutionary. Today, it is hard to believe that a Saint like Him ever graced this planet.

Pranaams to Him and to all who felt Him.

Abhisek Davey

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Hari Sharanam

Swamiji would rarely write about His life. But when you hear today His pravachans, you sometimes get a glimpse or two. Recently, I heard Him saying in a pravachan that at initial stages of His sadhana, He was so determined that He would weigh food before eating (neither more nor less). But He would fondly talk about Jaydayalji Goendka. He said that seeing Sethji eating was like seeing a machine working !! Maharajji 's mother was an extra ordinary mother. She handed over Maharajji to Saints when He was only 4 years old. Once in a pravachan, Maharajji said: YOU WILL NOT FIND A MOTHER LIKE MY MOTHER ( Mer Maa jaisi Maa nahin milegi, aapko). He was very respectful for His mother. He said in a pravachan: Now a 4 year old kid, how can he make Guru. I never made Guru. If somebody made me chella , that is not my fault. As rightly observed by Sadhak G B , Swamiji strongly opposed Guru-Chella relationship. Swamiji had a goal after "His Kalyaan"- How to make Humanity at large Realise God in the quickest possible time.

Ankuur

-------------------------------------------

Swamiji was very clear in his message that he wants the seekers to develop direct relationship with God.
Swamiji's teachings are the medium which God, the ultimate guru, is using to give you knowledge of Him.
So, I request sadhak's to glorify God in accordance with Swamiji's teachings.
Swamiji was against the glorification of individual person.

At His feet in service,
G B

---------------------------------------------------

OM VAASUDEVAAYA NAMAH

YAT YAT VIBHUTIMAT SATTVAM SHREEMAT-URJITAMEVA VAA |
TAT TAT EVA GACHCHAATVAM MAM TEJONSHA SAMBHAVAM || (GitaJi - 10/41)

OM NAMAH ITI!

Niteesh Dubey

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Hari Om

The world is said to be the FIRST avataar (incarnation) of Paramatma. And....India is the land of spirituality. It is said that in the world there is NEVER an absence of Saints, Mahatmas and Bhaktas. In the last 150 years, in India itself a battery of Yogis and God Realised persons have taken birth. If Revered Ramakrishna Paramhans was a perfect Bhakti Yogi, then his illustrious disciple Swami Vivekanand was an outstanding Karma Yogi. Revered Ramana Maharshi was a Jnana Yogi in the truest sense of Gita and scriptures. Then you have outstanding persons in the field of spirituality like Aurobindo, and Father of Nation, Mahatma Gandhi. Gandhiji was a true seeker and believer in Satya and Ahimsa. ( Truth and Non violence). Little wonder , his last words were Raam....Raam...Raam.

In the same India during 20th century, 4 extra ordinary devotees of Param Pita Parameshwar graced this pious land, at the same time, known to each other. They are 1) Sethji Jaidayalji Goendka 2) Sethji's mother's sister's son...Bhaiji Hanuman Prasadji Poddar 3) Param Shraddheya Swamiji Shri Ramsukhdasji Maharaj and 4) Param Shraddheya Sharananandji Maharaj. All four realised God in this human birth and their conduct was exemplary when tested by the yardstick/ bench mark of Shrimad Bhagwadgita. Their contribution to humanity can not be described in words. Look at their contribution through Gita Press , Gorakhpur alone. This institution is running for more than 80 years now, and it has never accepted any advertisements to support its operating expenses. One can not imagine as to how an institution can supply religious Scriptures and books at such low prices for so long a time without any external assistance like advertisements !! You have to believe on God and His Grace and His support when you examples like this.

Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj was greatly influenced by Sethji and confirmed during His pravachans that both Sethji and Bhaiji had the darshanas of Bhagwaan during this human life. Sharananandji Maharaj redefined all Darshanas , then existing. He was a truly surrendered devotee of Paramatma. His darshan was extra ordinary and totally novel when compared with other 6 darshanas.

What to talk of Maharajji !! He was walking, living , breathing Shrimad Bhagwad Gita. He never looked at the world for getting anything out of it. He gave, gave and gave to the world. He set divine heights for a human conduct, which may never be touched again. He was all in one...Jnana Yogi, Karma Yogi, Bhakti Yogi and Premi of Paramatma. The title MAHATMA , As per Gita ...7:19 ...truly belongs to Saints like Him only. Can any one imagine the austerity entailed in the resolve of that person who decided in today's world ....I will never touch money and woman. I will never desire/ demand anything from any body in this world !! To say it is easy...but to live.....think Divine Sadhaks !! Total desirelessness means Param Shraddheya Swamiji Shri Ramsukhdasji Maharaj ! He wanted to see Sethji for the first time in His life but had to wait for long because He had no money to travel upto Sethji's place and He would not demand anything from anybody !!!!

I am reminded here of an example of His resolve. Once He agreed to give pravachan in the evening session in a fairly distant village from the village He was then staying. He completed His Satsanga at 9:30 pm. Those who organised His one time visit there wanted Him to stay overnight there. But Swamiji was committed to give pravachan at other distant place at 5 am next day. Organisers told Him, kindly stay here to night because the only car available has gone out of order and has been sent for repairs and there is no way He can leave the village in the night, as there was no vehicle available at that time. Swamiji did not agree and started His walk towards that village ,on foot, all alone, towards that village where He had committed next day's morning pravachan. People told Him , it is impossible for you to reach there without any vehicle on time. But Swamiji said : My duty is to begin my journey right now. I don't care whether I reach there on time or not. Reaching there on time is not in my hands ( ma phaleshu kadachan- Gita- 2:49) but to begin journey is in my hands ( Karmanye vaadhikaraste- Gita- 2:49 ) !!!

Can words describe glory of such Mahatma ? Can there be a better example of living Gita ? Humanity is blessed that such Mahatma ever put His feet on this earth. This Forum is dedicated to such Mahatma, O Divine Sadhaks !!

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

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Jai Shri Krishna

Maharajji had one Divine drive in Him , an object....How a human should emancipate as quickly as possible. He kept on working in that direction through out His life and gave to all of us UNIQUE, SUPER FAST, EASIEST methods of Realisation.....Hey Naath ....Hey Mere Naath...Main Aapko Bhoolu Nahin !! O God...O My God , let me never forget you....!!! Can there be an easier method than this? He was an innovator. He once said so long as even one soul on this planet is bondaged, how can We take rest? A Divya Vibhooti... Maharajji.

Ashish Dhawan

-----------------------------------------------------

Aum Vishwasmaiye Namah

DIVI SURYASAHASTRASYA BHAVEDYUGPADUTTHITA !
YADI BHAH SADRISHI SA SYADBHASASTASYA MAHATMAN !!

o Mahatman ! If on sky thousand Suns rise simultaneously and there is light emanating therefrom, still , O Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj , perhaps that can not be more than the Light which you caused in our souls, in our hearts, in our antahkarana and in our human lives.

Hey Mahatma....

NAMAH PURSTADATH PRISHTHATASTE, NAMOSTU TE SARVAT EVA SARVA !!

ankuur

-----------------------------------------------

Raam...!

Swamiji would answer to any query almost instantlyand had the capacity to understand a question even before the Questioner completed. His answers would invariably make the questioner SPEECHLESS. He would also accept written Qs and insisted that whenever any body writes a query to Him, the writing should begin with God's name like Om, Raam etc. He said we all should inculcate habit of speaking and writing God's name at the beginning of everything.Hence the first lesson we all should learn while responding even in this Divine forum is to begin your response with God's name. Moderators never forget to do that.

Consider the following reply given by Maharajji in a Question -Answer session::

Shrotaa: Here one lady was smoking BEEDI . I told her not to do, she said Swamiji says that in everything there is Bhagwaan and hence in Beedi also there is Bhagwaan (and hence what is wrong in my smoking Beedi?) !!

Swamiji : Very Right ! Yes I also said that in Hells also there is Bhagwaan. If you smoke Beedi, you will have to suffer in hells: in hells also God is there. There you get shoe (jootaa) hitting you, in that shoe also there is Bhagwaan. You get beating there, in that beating also there is Bhagwaan !

Then He went on to say....Remember, those who take bahanaa ( shelter) of God like this, and do prohibited deeds, they will suffer more than those who do not ascribe such reasons.

At that point I understood, Vasudev Sarvam is a concept which should not be used that casually and frequently !!

Raam....!!

Sachin

------------------------------------------

Shree Hari Ram Ram

Swamiji we love you dearly. You always were, are and always will be my very own. You are many things to many, but for me you are simply SWEET ! MADHUR ! Your eyes, out of this world. Your smile !!! There are no words to describe. Only that I am deeply grateful to God for blessing me with your darshan. I came to see you with pages of questions, and all questions disappeared the moment I saw you. It was the beginning of never ending joy. Thank you ! for everything! May I continue to live my life per your words. May my life be such that it always pleases you. With love, Meera Das, Ram Ram

------------------------------------------

Hare Krishna

Words fail in talking about Shraddheya Swamiji. He is a Mahatma...in the "purest sense of the word" , as stated by a sadhak on this Forum.Mahatma means- Mahaan Aatma in other words a soul which is sans ahambhaav, personality, and centralisation (ekdesheeyata)...completely devoid of these 3. One who has personality , me-ness, and non-universalness (ekdesheeyata) is "alpaatma" (opposite of Mahatma). Bhagwaan has called a Mahatma to be rare but Himself to be easy. Because if you search God, you will find Him anywhere , He is everywhere but a Saint and Mahatma like Shraddheya Maharajji....VERY RARE, VERY VERY RARE.

Blessed is that dust on which Swamiji walked. Blessed are those people who saw Swamiji. Blessed are those places where Swamiji visited. All mahatmya (glory) of darshanas, meetings, thinking about such Mahatmas is in this Mrityu Loka only.

Manoj Srivastava

--------------------------------------------

Hari Sharanam

I always "felt" that if you go to satsanga of Swamiji
with any question in mind, without even asking your question, in that Satsanga pravachan itself you will get answer. This personally happened with me many times and hence this is my direct experience. I can never forget one day when I was doing svaadhyaay and was wondering as to what is wrong in doing upasana of anything in this world , however that may be, after all Gita says that all forms be it Sattwik, Rajasic or Tamasic all are of God only. Then, in the evening I got the audio cassette of His one pravachan and He said:

" Agar koi taamas upasana karega to usko narak roop se Bhagwaan milenge: kyonki narak bhi Bhagwaan hee hain. Is liye "jaanane" tathaa "maanane" main to sab Bhagwaan ka hee svaroop hai, lekin "karane" main upasana karane yogya roop aur upasana na karane yogya roop alag alag hain"....!!!!

If some one does Tamasic upasana, he will get hells, because hells also are Bhagwaan only. Therefore in "knowing" and "accepting/believing" , all are svaroops of Bhagwaan, but in doing there are two divisions 1 What form is worthy of upasana 2 What form is not worthy of upasana.

Pranaams O Mahatma, Pranaams

Mohit

----------------------------------------------

Aum Namah Shivaay

Once a listener asked Maharajji that while you say very high standard thing, but why it is not setting in us? Instantly came reply:

There is no desire in you of own welfare, that is why ! Then He spoke the following two liner:

SANTDAAS SANSAAR MAIN , KAI GUGGU KAI DOD !
DOOBAN KO SAANSO NAHIN, NAHIN TIRAN KO KOD !!

Later on I came to know for the first time that Guggu means owl ,who can not see in day, and Dod means a type of big crow who can not see in night.

He went on to say ....MERE KO BAHUT UTSAAH AATA HAI, PAR KOI MILATA NAHIN HEE NAHIN ! JISME SACHEE KALYAAN KI CHAHANA HO, WAH AAYE ! I am very enthuastic , but I dont find reciprocating person. Come to me, if you have ardent desire (for self welfare...Kalyaan) !!

Amazing, Divine...ALAUKIK Saint is Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj.

Sanjay

-------------------------------------------------

Radhey ! Radhey !!

Once somebody asked Swamiji - " You dont get yourself photographed.How will we
remember you later on?" The Great Sage replied: "Remember not me, remember
Bhagwan. I am not getting myself photographed because people will remember me if
I get myself photographed. There is no benefit in remembering me. Real benefit
is in remembering Bhagwaan. One who gets himself photographed is ANTI GOD. Is it
fair to put obstacles in the remembrance of Bhagwaan ?

What a Divine answer He gave to the following Question asked by a listener in
Surat in January 2000!!!

Q was- WHEN GOD IS OURS, THEN HOW DID WE GET AWAY FROM HIM? HOW DID WE FALL INTO
THE CIRCLE OF 84 LAC LIFE FORMS?

Maharajji replied....." I will answer you but there is no benefit of you in
knowing that, there is harm to you instead. How did stool touched with your
body? when did it happen? What is the benefit in knowing this? You have dirt on
your person, simply clean it, that is it? It is not wisdom to worry about that
which is now past. There is one idiom..."GAYI TITHI KO BRAHMIN BHI NAHIN
BACHATA" ( Even an astrologer does not comment on whatever has already
happened).

Once a listener asked Him...Q: HAVE YOU REALISED GOD ?

What an answer :

" How much money you have? Where have you kept the same? Tell me ! You dont tell
even your Rupee balance to others, then whether God is cheap and inferior to
even Rupees? Actually this is not a question to be asked. One who asks such
question is stupid and one who correctly replies it is also stupid.

Once a listener asked Him....Q : Just as by looking at rich person , there comes
an enthusiasm in other that I should also earn money, similarly, if you make us
see God then our enthusiasm will increase.

Swamiji replied..." I can not do that, but if YOU ACCEPT then you can have
darshanas of Bhagwaan. Then only it is possible. I am narrating an incident
which occured before me. Here under Vat Vriksha , one brother told Sethji (
Jaidayalji Goendka) - "We trust you. You always speak truth. You tell us there
is Bhagwaan." . Sethji replied: I will tell you, but you will not agree
(accept). He replied " We will agree". Sethji asked him to come near to him and
said ; " Look that is Sun God " . The brother replied : " That I always see".
Sethji said; " Entire world calls it Sun God, I am showing you God". Vishnu,
Ganesha, Shankar, Shakti and Sun , these five are accepted to be God. But if you
dont accept, what can I do?

Swamiji concluded : " Therefore I dont have any method of getting you Darshans
of Bhagwaan, you have that method with you " !!!!!

Radhey ! Radhey !!

Nisha Chatterji

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Swamiji's messages are so simple, so effective and they touch me deeply. I am sorry , I never had darshan of him, but feel relieved since the day I heard a question answer session, where Swamiji clearly states. That you will feel my presence all the time, through Sadhak Sanjivani. it brought tremendous sense of comfort, and since then I have found this to be true. Thank you for the opportunity to share.

Bina G K

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I am fortunate in one way and not so fortunate otherwise.

I never got to see and interact the person that is referred to here. Therefore, no emotional relation was ever built. I happen to know Swamiji as KNOWLEDGE and as ITS SEEKER. The two transcend birth and death. Thus, I have neither witnessed nor acknowledged any element of Swamiji that remained within any birth-death span. To me, he remains as eternal as THE KNOWLEDGE as ever. Therefore, neither Janmatithi nor PuNyatithi does ring a bell here. Fortunate I am that I can really feel the reality of THE REALITY!!!

At the same time, this physical entity here missed to witness the physical cunterpart of the person identified as Swamiji ... this wants to appreciate how that coped with its lord ... how that fused in his austerities ... how that sought its destiny travelling along such a hardcore truth seeker within ... this fellow misses that ... not so fortunate this is.

Respects.

Naga Narayana.

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I know of Swamiji through other sadhaks, I listen to his pravachans constantly. Late nights when all are asleep listening to his lectures is the most effective. His messages pierce deeply. I remember the points the next day. Life has never been the same, since Swamiji and God came into my life.

sarita

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unake liye [jaisaa unase seekhaa] :

That which was, it is there right now as well, and that which was not there, is not there so far.

HINDI
jo thaa vah to abhee bhee hai aur jo naheen thaa vah abhee tak naheen hai.
saadhaka

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To all Sadhakas,

Swami RamSukhdasji was rarest of the rare saints, a personification of God-Realized, jivan-mukta whose selfless life work and teachings serve and will continue to serve as a beckon light to all seekers.

On this double-auspicious day of Guru Purnima, this lay seeker offers soul-felt koti koti pranaams to this great soul.

May our saadhana deepen with Swami ji's teachings and blessings.

Peace.

k

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Shree Hari Ram Ram

Few Thoughts on Swamiji's Punaya Tithi

Today is 'Punya Tithi' of our beloved Param Sharadhya Swami Ramsukhdasji. We are very fortunate to have been associated with a great soul. It is a fortunate moment to remember one of the greatest saints of modern times who has inspired many Sadhaka to march towards the ultimate goal of human life of merging with the Supreme Consciousness through many discourses and most profound Gita Teeka-- Sadhak Sanjivani. His passion has been to show how quickly the struggling Sadhaks can achieve fast progress to reach the goal of human life. It is no wonder that his simple words make such an enormous impact on the Sadhkas because he has lived his own life as a model, strictly based on principles enshrined in Gitaji. Here are a few excerpts from his discourses and Sadhak Sanjivani:

. Eternal peace is possible only when one is able mentally to free himself from the worldly relationships (persons and things etc.) and makes a connection at the deepest level of his being with the source which is God only (Gitaji: 15/7). We are one with God and not one with the world since it is constantly separating from us. Sadhaka should make a top priority of making the primary goal of life as union with God only. Practice Swamiji's Panch Amritas (I am God's etc., ).

. The Lord incarnates in the world to set an example to other people. He does not live for Himself and knows the art of living in the world. The world is an educational institution where we have to learn how to do good to others by renouncing desire, attachment and selfishness etc. Through this lesson, we have to attain salvation. While living in the world, we have to perform our duty by serving others and doing good to them including members of our family and try to lead one another towards salvation (Gita:3/24).

. Whatever we see it is God only and whatever is happening is His sport (Lila) only. It is God only one who is inside and outside of all things and persons, pervading all (Gita: 13/15, 7/7). He is only one Who is complete and all the rest is incomplete. God is "ISNESS' in everything WHO is always there just like we understand-- SPACE is there everywhere! All the things of the world are marching towards "Nothingness". But there is no empty space or place where God is not present. Think of this idea 15-20 times during each day.

. The biggest Punya (merit) and biggest Papa (sin) are both 1-1/2. Turning towards and establishing relationship with God is full Punya and doing good deeds is half a Punya. Having a relationship with the world is a full papa and doing bad actions is half of papa. The greatest harm is done when you are turning away from God.

. It is necessary to discern (with Viveka) and accept what is real and unreal (Nitya and Anitya Viveka -- (Gitaji 2/12-/13). The prime hurdle for the human being is the assumption that he is the body and mind only. He assumes relationship (Samband or Apnapan ) with the worldly people, things and situations etc. This relationship is false in the present, past and future.

. For steady progress on spiritual path, seeking or expecting pleasure from others is a big hurdle, instead should do SEVA to others with the available resources without expectation of any personal reward. Always look for ways and means to make others happy. With this one will attain equanimity (Samta) which is a sure means to achieve freedom.

. Whatever we know to be true, if we firmly accept that to be true and perform actions accordingly, there is no doubt that one is sure to make tremendous progress . One should not desire for a new thing, do not have the sense of mineness with what we already have and do not have anguish of what is gone (Gita 3/30).

. One should not think, say, listen, wish, hope, listen bad about others, it is the biggest SEVA to mankind.

. Having desire for worldly objects, persons and circumstances is one single important enemy of man which is the seed for all sins (Gita:3/37). One should not desire for a new thing, do not have the sense of mineness with what we already have and do not have anguish of what is gone (Gita 3/30).

. We should not have insistence on what should happen and what else should not happen.

. Do not do work but do all work as a Pooja to God (Gita: 3/27, 4/24, 18/46)

. Even if you are a sinner, you should not get disappointed, once you turned towards (accept) Me with a firm resolve, you will become a saint.

. Be always happy, no matter what. Whatever is coming to us is from God only, He does not make mistakes, even the bad situations too are meant for our ultimate good only

. The resource of time in our life is of very valuable essence, we have to use this resource wisely

. Do not just read or listen only to increase your so called knowledge but act on it too!

Humbly,

Madan Kaura
Ram Ram

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Hari Om

3rd July by English Calendar ...the Nirvaan Day of one of the Greatest Saints who ever walked on this planet. Words fail to describe His glory , it can only be felt not expressed. ..Jyon Goonge Gur Khaayo..the Bliss emanating out of His remembrance, association, words, is indeed as such..Just As : The taste of jaggery can be felt only by the dumb.

His principles were very simple and friendly of every human..easy to implement. Consider the following of His principal principles:

1 Every human has a birth right to get God Realisation.

2 Every human can emancipate himself/herself in staying put with whatever caste, creed, religion, position, ashram, sect, dressing, country etc in which he/she already is . (No change is required)

3 Every human can get God in whatever position/circumstance/state he/she is. There is no need for any change in any circumstance.

4 You get worldly things 'by doing' karma; but you get Paramatma by ' not doing' anything.

5 You do not get Paramatma by using the tools/ body/ organs/ inert ( mind, intellect, sense organs, body etc.. prakruti/ anything that changes)...you get Him by renouncing inert .

6 God is the name of that:

- Who is in all. Since He is in all, He is in each one of us also. We need not search Him anywhere. We need not go anywhere. Where ever we are, He is there.

- Who belongs to all. Since He belongs to all, He is of each one of us. Since He is ours, there will be 'Love' flowing in us effortlessly, automatically.

- Who is present at all times. Since He is present at all times, He is present now also. We don't have to expect for future at all.

- Who is the kindest. Since He is the kindest, none of us needs to get
hopeless or dejected.

- Who is All Powerful. Since He is the most powerful, none of us needs to become fearful.

- Who is unique. Since He is second to none, we will not have to recognise Him or describe Him.

7 A mere 'acceptance' with a child like faith and simple heart that 'I am God's; only God is mine; nothing else is mine' is enough to realise Him. It is a law: Every acceptance produces experience.

8 'Acceptance' means establishing exclusive relationship/ mineness with God. It is a law: Love emanates effortlessly out of mamata (mineness). If we 'accept' mineness with Him, Love will flow in us automatically/effortlessly.

9 Love for God (PREM) is the final goal. There is nothing beyond Prem.
Look Divine Sadhaks at the simplicity of His principles !

Pranaams to you Taat Shree..the world will continue to be indebted to you, O Divine Saint...for ages and eons..for kalpas !!

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

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extremely reasonable prices if you wish to order to gift or donate to schools, libraries, local temples or children's birthday parties etc.

Or you may visit
our online books for FREE at: http://www.swamiramsukhdasji.net/ebooks.html

Ram Ram

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