Monday, February 28, 2011

[gita-talk] Re: Are we Giving Importance to what we know to be TRUE? Your Insights Please !

 

Shree Hari Ram Ram

In recent "SADHAKA DAILY MESSAGES" Swamiji has addressed giving importance to
what we know to be TRUE....
Are we utilizing what we know to be true? Have we understood the term
"perishable" (naashvaan). Do we know ourselves as imperishable? Do we know that
the imperishable cannot be gratified by the perishable?
Are we getting trapped? Are we being stupid? Are we cheating ourselves? Do we
know / understand that it is only on realizing the Eternal, Imperishable
Paramatma that we will be satisfied?

Your INSIGHTS please !!!
Gita Talk Moderators, Ram Ram

-----------------------------------------------

Sir,
Everything is perishable. Seeing this, recognising this automatically connects us to imperishableness.
Imperishable is not like perishable. It is imperishableness. No idea as to good-bad can be formed in relation to imperishableness.
Mind can not attain it as mind is bound by the law of contrast. When it sees that it is helpless in coming out of contrast, it is relieved.Imperishableness is recognised.
Y V Chawla

-----------------------------------------------

Hari Om

The message of Notesh Otes is bit harsh, not only on this Divine Forum but also on teachings of Shrimad Bhagwad Gita. To my belief, a parrot like reader of Gita is infinite times better than the non reader of Gita.

Reading Bhagwad Gita is not physical at all ! A sadhak ( striver/ reader of Gita as sadhana included ..) is never body ..never manifest ...He is always unmanifest ! In fact, those who do not read Gita or accept its teachings are in Delhi's Jantar Mantar ..certainly not those who read it, study it and experience its eternal teachings. Reading Gita, in fact, removes doubts, confusions and conflicts, ...there is no question of it causing conflicts or confusions..!! Rather, the connection with world and faulty acceptance etc cause conflicts and confusions ..but never Shrimad Bhagvad Gita...in whichever way you read it !

Three themes have been insisted upon 1 Consciousness 2 Devotion 3
Transcendence, with a claim that Gita teaches those themes ! At the outset, let me state that the 'consciuosness' is not a part of 'any process' ! If at all it is of some spiritual value, it is name of ' IS-NESS' ..but to denote that there are better terms/words like 'Existence' (satta-matra) BHAAV (opposite of ABHAAV) / IS-NESS/ SAT/ imperishable / permanent /soul etc are employed in Gita...! Only once in Gita , the word 'consciousness'. (chetana) has been used ... to merely denote it as a part/modification of inert/insentient Prakruti ..Read BG 13: 6 ...Chetana !! That is all Gita talks about the word 'Consciousness' !!!

Transcendence..yes you must ! But to transcend what? Actually to transcend 'thoughts' / mind . Now as per Gita what you call 'consciousness' is part of Prakruti ...and you must 'transcend' Prakruti ( Read Gita : 14:19...Gunebhyasya paramvetti; 15:18- I am beyond Nature) and hence you must transcend 'consciousness' (chetana)/ mind/thoughts as they are part/modification of Prakruti...!! That is one meaning given by Gita. Non Gita readers may use this word 'consciousness' to denote existence/is-ness ( Present) / soul/ Self BUT then in that case it is not "Process" ...it is the GOAL ...it is the 'realization itself' of the same .. It is 'smriti' (18:73 )..rememembering a forgotten existing Truth...changeless truth...AS IT IS Truth ! You can't link then the 'consciousness' with 'thoughts' ! Of course, the IS-NESS / MERE EXISTENCE is totally different than AWARENESS !! The most of so called pundits of 'Consciousness' actually end up understanding it as AWARENESS ...and Gita precisely calls this AWARENESS as CHETANA..inert/insentient ..a modification of Prakruti !!! When you are not 'aware' then also you are Prakruti-stha (situate in Prakruti) only ..example ..deep sleep state, faint state...! Hence awareness (chetana) is 'relative' not absolute.

In any case, if you mean by 'consciousness' the soul / present/ self /mere existence / bhava/ Is-ness/ Sat etc , then also how can the question of 'raising/elevating its level' arise ? If it means soul / self etc then it is NOT subject to CHANGE. How can you change it by raising or lowering its level /characteristics/ quality/standard/ position etc ?

Now come to thoughts ! "Thoughts", being output of an inert machine called 'mind' , can ONLY be about the physical ( world / matter+activity) ! Thoughts can never be about the "Present", about what exists, about the absolute, about in your words 'non-physical' ( God/ higher power) ...NEVER ! Actually, mind (and hence thoughts) can either travel in "past" or in 'future' and both DO NOT EXIST !!! 'Naught' (asat) is mind (thoughts) and in 'naught' ONLY mind ALWAYS remains positioned ...Note this fact in your Gita diary for ever !! Mind can ONLY remain 'positioned' in Asat / Mithya / Inert/ non-existent zone ! Rightly so...because it is part of ASAT / Non-existent creator of it viz Prakruti. That is why you are taught in Gita to make mind equanimous ! Because on one hand it can not reach Paramatma ( Sat / Present / Is-ness/ What exists ) while on other hand it becomes disinterested in world (its subjects) because the Self has stopped giving any recognition/respect to the 'world' ('physical' in your words) ! Hence it falls into an optionless 'equanimous zone' ! That optionlessness of mind is called 'silencing of mind' ... thoghtlessness... desirelessness .. equanimity ...!! Hence mind / thoughts get silenced because there is no 'desire in Self' for the world ..and without the Self being interested, the mind receives no commands to loiter in world. That mind , thoughtless mind is Peace...Silence...!!

Hence Gita does not teach you " to raise the level of mind/thoughts or consciousness" as claimed by you ..rather it teaches you to transcend the very affinity with them, to renounce them, to disconnect with them ! In reality, the goal of every Yogi ( Sadhak) of Gita ..be it Karma Yogi or Jnana Yogi or Bhakti Yogi is : To reach to a 'thoughtless' /'mindless' state !!! SILENCE ( thoughtlessness / desirelessness/ doershipless ...) is the goal !

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

--------------------------------------------

-Shree Hari-
Namaste!

Thomas Merton:

When we are reduced to our last extreme, there is no further evasion. The choice is a terrible one. It is made in the heart of darkness, but with an intuition that is unbearable in its angelic clarity: when we who have been destroyed and seem to be in hell miraculously choose God! (NMI, 208).

Vaasishtha:

628. The mind makes an aeon (appear as) a moment within, and brings a moment to the nature of an aeon. Therefore, they consider the space-time order as dependent on that (mind).

629. (The mind) causes this error consisting of the mental object having destruction as its nature, which is only unreal and has the appearance of the real, as a dream (causes) another dream (within it).

Bhagavad- Gita 6/14:
Firm in the vow of complete chastity and fearless, keeping himself perfectly calm and with the mind held in restraint and fixed on Me, the vigilant Yogi should sit absorbed in Me.

Thomas Merton (a Trappist monk), describes the realization re the mind as described by Vaasishtha (628-629), and the shock of it, thus the only option is to turn to God. You notice he used the word intuition not knowledge.

Now on the other hand, such reduction to the last extreme is not a problem to the Yogi who follows the Guidance of Sri Krisna, you notice the word fearless , and the mind kept in restraint.

The mind is an illusionists, a trickster. True knowledge as apposed to perceived knowledge is not found in the mind, it is beyond the mind.

Sacred books, leaned discourse, great sat gurus, can only guide you on the journey to Truth. The 'Awareness', (true knowledge) is for the Self to find!

Om ... Shanti ...

Mike.
--------------------------------------------

Dear Holly Sadaks,
Namaskar!

Everybody speaks of Perishable and Nonperishable. According to Science Matter or Energy

can neither be created nor destroyed but, it would keep on changing its form only. Therefore, nothing can be perishable in the real sense. Everything is Nonperishable!!

The TRUTH seems to be that EVERYTHING (VASUDEVA SERVAM) is Nonperishable. Through the Maya of Vsudeva itself, Perishable is an eternal property of change existing and injected into the Nonperishable, keeping as ever US (ignorant) wondering while HISELF (Vsudeva) playing as Leela!!!

Otherwise PLEASE, may anybody tell me what was the basic idea of creating this Perishable lie (like ME, YOU or even infinite Universes) at all to begin with? In other words, why Lord (Vasudeva) created the trouble BY separating ATMA from PARMATMA and force it later through hectic exercises of various Yoga to merge back into PARMATMA???????????? Can my LORD be that idiot?? I do not think it so!!!

I am
(Kuldeep Kumar Kaul)

-----------------------------------

Hari Om

Problem is that we 'know' but we do not 'accept' ! In Hindi : HAM JAANATE HAIN
LEKIN MAANATE NAHIN !

We know whatever rises, sets. We know who ever takes birth, dies! Who does not
know that? But still, if some near and dear dies, we grieve ! At the same time,
we do not grieve when in the evening the Sun sets. In the latter case,we 'know'
as well as 'accept' that the Sun sets in the evening. So we do not grieve. In
the former case, we 'know' one must die, but we do not 'accept' ..hence we
become sorrowful.

We 'know' smoking is bad, still we smoke. We 'know' telling lies is bad, still
we tell lies. We 'know' greed is bad, still we become swayed by greed. Why ? We
'know' but we do not 'accept' !

We know the nature of 'perishable' still we ' like to accept' the perishable to
be 'permanent' !! Oh...how much trouble we take to justify our insistence of
somehow seeing permanency in temporary ... including even bringing Vasudev
Sarvam truth ... What do we not do to see what we 'know' is perishable but we do
not 'accept' to be perishable ? Amazing ...!!!

Hence we must re-visit our 'acceptances' ( beliefs/assumptions / affinities/
connections) ....!

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

-------------------------------------------------

Spiritual wisdom is that.....

All creation, perishable or not perishable, is for our happiness and
satisfaction......every little thing/situation/relationship in this world is for
our happiness.....We need to have that helicopter view to enjoy every moment....
Perishable is not to be worried about but understood in right perspective and to
be used as the invisible ladder for going up to that eternal happiness...

Understanding, experimenting, experiencing the wisdom of life is the doorway to
that bliss..... i.e. eternal is achieved only when our every moment is
established in that unconditional bright happiness (beyond happiness and
unhappiness)....

Remember, we all have that happy natural state (HNS) within us....... HNS is
that state of "Nothing" from where originate everything...
Strong understanding, awareness and experience, helps the ball rolling and
builds the conviction.....contemplation is the key...

Sushil Jain

--------------------------------------------------

until our last breath we ourselves and people around us feel and take us to
be present and never feel we are perishable and upto that time we are true
although wek now that ATMA is imperishable as said in sri Gitaji  nainam
chindanti shastrani----------------------

how then a person has to differentiate between perishable and non perishable .
what i feel from sri Gita ji karmanye dhivadhikaraste--------should be followed
for grihasth peapleÂ
jai shri krishna

Chaman nigam
----------------------------------------------

Dear Gita-group,

Yes, everyone is giving too much importance to physical/maya
truth. All of you have nothing else to go by. You all are reading
Bhagwat-Gita like a parrot and you are not applying the teachings
of Bhagwat Gita on yourself. Bhagwat-Gita talks about consciousness,
devotion and transcendence. These three words will teach you
how to "transform your thoughts from physical-thoughts to non-
physical-thoughts (God, higher power, source). This process will
begin to find your "absolute"/non-physical truth.

You will have to raise the level of mind/consciousness, prayers/devotion
and this process will be beyond-physical/transcendence. Reading
Gita is all physical and you may not find your answers this way,
instead, you will find coflicts, confusions and you may go into
junter-munter of New Delhi as many people (of your group) have
been going there and getting lost.

Good Luck! Bye!

Notesh Otes
--------------------------------------------------

Dear Sadhakas, it is a great invitation to share our insights into what
Moderators and Nagaji have shred with us from Swamiji's Treasure!
We need to clearly see that anything known or unknown, including body-mind-sense
complex given to us which we call "I", is perceived by senses and subsequently
conceived by mind with a name. All such conceived(thought-of) objects of this
world are in mind which functions in time-space fabric only, and hence are
perishable in time! Check this out by contemplating upon it.
Now, That which conceives objects through body-mind-senses cannot ITSELF be
conceived as another object of this world, and hence is free of time-space
fabric and therefore, is necessarily Imperishable! Even as IT cannot be known as
another object, it is our experience that IT knows through us and therefore, IT
IS, and hence is ITS own proof, being Self-evident Existence we feel we ARE!
Knowing this Truth as our true nature, the Real "I" that I am, is crown Jewel
of discrimination (Vivek Chudamani)!
So, Swamiji is asking us to stand as our true Self, the only Truth of perishable
World! This will free us from all attachment to "me" and its created world!
Know also that perishable objects exist only on Imperishable Existence, just as
waves on ocean, snake on rope, jewelries on Gold!
It is IMPERISHABLE which is GOD, appearing as forms of perishable objects!
And ... when we understand this by contemplating on it, we say "Vasudev Sarvam"!
Pratap Bhatt

---------------------------------------------------
Dear Sadaks,
We know we are perishable, and we know that we not the body, but we are Aham
Bhramasmi, we know we are trapped, we know we are stupid and cheating ourselves,
and we know we want to escape from these. But then why we are not getting out of
Maya. Strictly speaking 90% of us are aware. But what prevents us from raising
to higher level? Only very very few realized the importance. We know Geetha and
Sri Krishna and Swamiji and his teachings. But we cannot put in practice- Why?
Judge, Police, Ministers, Govt Servants know that taking bribe is crime. Person
to person cheating we know that we accumulate sins. But we do them without fear-
Why? Sadaks find out this obstacle then it is easy to liberate.
B.Sathyanarayan

-----------------------------------------------

What 'this specfic-named' person referred to by mistake as I do is what
(this) I am destined to do because of the properties/ Gunas imparted to this
particular stula-suksma-karan body mistakenlt referred to as I. This I will
cheat itself and ask why, will know that it is perishable within a very
short period of time and yet act as if that short period is infinite time,
This I is designed to act stupid, trapped in illusion even if this I comes
to know the Truth. All this is but natural and not amazing. That is one
Truth that this I also knows and need not bother. The real Truth is that
there is the Other I which is permanent, ceaseless, unperturbed by what the
perishable I's do and do not do. It is that Other I that this I is destined
to vanish in. Can the existence this other I be experienced even as this
perishable I functions in its own guna and illusion led existence. That is
the only important issue: going beyond the darkness of the perishable I to
enjoy the existence of the ceaseless I. Will this happen!
Basudeb Sen

----------------------------------------------

To feel satisfied, seek satisfaction that any possession, relationship,

situation, idea is good, important, sacred, moral, right, beneficial and so

on apart from its use, is the psychological comfort to which the mind
clings

Then is there nothing as good?

Everything has usage value and that is the only goodness of it.

Y V Chawla

Give Importance to what you Know to be True

Again, a wonderful teaching (rather a whip) from Swamiji with a precision of
RaambaaNa!
"Whatever circumstances one has been placed in, consider those circumstances and
situations as best of all and utilize it well, then you will be benefited … Your
knowledge is not less, however, what you know you are not utilizing it well … If
you utilize this knowledge properly, then this knowledge that you have is
adequate for your benefit ... proper utilization of this knowledge is that, do
not get trapped in the circumstances that have presented themselves to you -
neither become elated or dejected in them."

1. There are two terms in Sanskrit - Rita and Satya. One means perceived truth
and the other the Absolute Truth. How anyone who cannot acknowledge perceived
truth ever can appreciate the Absolute Truth?
2. An individual IS SOLELY RESPONSIBLE FOR ONE'S HAPPINESS … also the individual
is the only one who is authorised to change one's state of presence - happy or
not.
3. Finally, one does not need anything other than oneself to make oneself happy.
If anything else is used to "bring" happiness in one's life, the thing that
apparently brought the pleasure is sure to perish … and so is the pleasure it
brought along.

The best is Swamiji's response to the questioner's apparent quest for more
knowledge - "Whatever you have knowledge about, are you utilizing that knowledge
properly?" What a wonderful whip any Saadhak need to savor all the time!!!
Quoting Swamiji from other texts, "Baavar bed bidush baavariyaa poti pustak
pandhaa …". Studies through even milleniums cannot bring the awareness, if we
are not willing to utilize the know how we are graced with as of now …

We often bring the so-called "nobility" and even "divinity" to escape from our
fundamental responsibility of being happy succumbing to our eternal hesitance to
exercize the only authority we ever have - to be happy.

Respects.

Naga Narayana.

=================================================

|| Shree Hari ||
Ram Ram

Give Importance to what you Know to be True

There is one very great point. Have mercy on me and please pay attention.
Whatever circumstances one has been placed in, consider those circumstances and
situations as best of all and utilize it well, then you will be benefited.
Whatever things you have received, you don't need any more things than that.
However much knowledge you have, you don't need to know any more than that. The
amount of strength that you have, you don't need any more than that. Paramatma
(God) can be realized simply by putting to proper use the strength, the
intellect, the abilities, the circumstances etc. that you have. This is the
absolute Truth and is the principle.

Your knowledge is not less, however, what you know you are not utilizing it
well. You do not give it importance - that is your limitation. The
circumstances that have been presented in front of you, will not remain like
this forever. This knowledge is not something that you know only slightly, you
know this completely and entirely. If you utilize this knowledge properly, then
this knowledge that you have is adequate for your benefit. It is not even
slightly deficient. The proper utilization of this knowledge is that, do not
get trapped in the circumstances that have presented themselves to you. Neither
become elated or dejected in them.

Questioner: We know this point, however the extent we desire to know, that
much knowledge we do not have.

Swamiji: Whatever you have knowledge about, are you utilizing that knowledge
properly? Those things that you know to be perishable, do you have desire to
attain it or not?

Questioner: Yes we do.

Swamiji: Then where have you understood the term "perishable"? In reality, if
you truly understood "perishable", then you would not desire to attain it. What
is the gain in attaining the perishable? Just like a wealthy man has money.
Without the money he would not be called wealthy, similarly this world has only
perishables and perishing things. That which is perishable how can it benefit
us, how can it be for our welfare?

You your "self" are not perishable, rather the body is perishable. That which
you have received is going to perish, but you the "self" will not perish.
Things were not there initially and will not be there later on. Rather even in
the present it is continuously moving towards destruction. You were there
initially and will remain even after. Your existence will remain at all times.
A question was put forth to me, that in the present how to gain knowledge of our
existence in the future? The answer to that is, that you are afraid to do bad
things and you are pleased when you do good deeds; because you are of the
sentiment that by doing evil deeds you will later on suffer, and by doing good
deeds, you will gain happiness in the future. This is proof that you have
accepted your existence in the future. If we do not accept our existence in the
future, then who will go to heaven? Who will go to hell? You will be
reincarnated? Who will be liberated? On attaining salvation, you will be
blissful or will the world be joyful? The point is that you will remain, and
the body and other things will not.

If you think carefully how can that which is eternal and imperishable attain
happiness from perishable? By saying that something is perishable it means, it
is nothing but destructible, besides being destructible and perishable, it has
nothing.

"Ant tohi tajainge paamar tu ne tajai ab hi te."

That thing which is going to perish, utilize it but do not trust it. Do not
depend on it as your support, having the notion that this thing will gratify me,
that it will lead to my prosperity etc. Think deeply about this - By getting
those things that are currently not with you, how will you be gratified? How
will you prosper? That which is not there right now, will also not remain later
on in the future. It will break away, therefore how will it make you happy?
Who knows with certainty whether you get it or not? And even if you get it, then
too it will not remain, because that which is perishable and destructible will
perish.

The body etc. is perishable - this you know, but you do not believe it. In
other words, you do not give importance to that which you know to be true. If
you gave importance to what you know, then you would not depend on perishables.
You would not have any expectation or hope from these perishables. You would
not become happy on getting them or meeting them. You would not be saddened by
not getting or meeting them. You would not desire for them to remain forever
and forever. You would not worry about them perishing. On not attaining the
situations that you desire, you become unhappy. Then this unhappiness is
nothing but stupidity. It is only stupidity. To want to hold on to those
things and situations that will not remain, and later being saddened by their
departure - what else is all this besides stupidity? If some calamity comes to
us, some sorrow comes to us, than we think how will this go away? But in
reality, it is going away. Whether it is favorable situations or unfavorable
ones, they will not remain. That which comes, is of the nature to go away.

Sarve kshayaantaa nichayaah patanaantaah samuchryaah

sanyogaa viprayogontaa marayaantam cha jeevitam (Valmiki 2/105/16)

The end of all hoarding is utter annihilation. The end of all worldly
successes is a fall. The end of coming together is parting ways. The end of
life is death.

That which is going to part, how can one gain happiness on meeting it? What is
there to be unhappy by it's going away. Neither happiness remains, nor sorrow
remains. Only the self remains. If the one that remains (Self), becomes one
that which comes and goes, one that is happy and sad, then it is only it's own
foolishness.

It is only on attaining That which never perishes, and That which is present
right now, Paramatma, one will gain the kind of happiness that remains forever.
Besides Paramatma if you become satisfied with anything else, whether it is
respect, honor, fame, relaxation, money, family, prosperity etc., you will be
cheated.

(to be continued)

From book in hindi "Acche Bano" and english "Be Good" by Swami Ramsukhdasji

**********************************************************************
Same message is available in HINDI - PLEASE VISIT:
http://www.satcharcha.blogspot.com
Titled "Acche Bano" on 23nd February, 2011.
*********************************************
HINDI : www.swamiramsukhdasji.org
ENGLISH: www.swamiramsukhdasji.net

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Sunday, February 27, 2011

[gita-talk] ATMA - How to realize? How to Love ? What it can do with Mind, Intellect, Body

 

Swami ji and Geeta ji gives importance to Atma, being our SELF. I am very confused I want to realise the same. But failed to understand Atma, what Atma can do with out mana, Budhi, and body.

How I should love Atma.

S. Goel

-------------------------------------------------------
Shree Hari Ram Ram

Attached from previous SADHAKA message may provide some insight into Atma / Self.

Question: What does it mean to know one's self (Atma)?

Answer: To know one's Self means that just like you have worn clothes, then are you the clothes ? No! Is the skin, you? No! Are you the flesh? No! Are you the blood? No! Are you the Pulse? No ! Are you the waste-matter in the intestine-bowels? No! Are you the one who arrives? NO! No I am not any of these ! In other words, that which you are not, do not accept is as "I am". Then you will know your self. It is such a simple and easy point! One time if you have accepted that "these I am not", thereafter, do not accept them as "I am". Do not spit out and later lick it again. To know one's self, to do nothing for one's self and to attain Paramatma (God) all three of these are very easy. What ever direction you wish to walk, is up to you.

See! I am telling you a point. This point is one of pride, but my intent is not to say it with pride. I have searched and am still searching on the subject - Ease of Realization. According to the scriptures the steps laid out are shravan (listening/hearing the divine names/qualities of the Lord), manan , niddhiyaasan , dharana (concentration), dhyaan (meditation), and samadhi (mystics absorption) - savikalp aur nirvikalp samaadhi, then sa-beej and nir-beej samaadhi and there after one attains realization. All these steps have been learned by me. I have also become quite immersed in these. I have done quite a bit of shravan, manan, niddhiyaasan, dhyaan, but the point is only one - "I am not that". Now for just this point why dig out a mountain?

I am telling you a simple point, but brothers and sisters, you do not have faith in it. Oh! Brothers ! I am not intent on cheating you. I am not intent on deceiving you ! I am not ambushing your trust ! I am sharing with you that by which you can realize as quickly as possible. In this you create your own obstacles, by saying - how is it possible for realization to take place so quickly? It did not happen with this other person, then how can it happen to us? What I am suggesting is try it out and see for your self. If you are unsuccessful, you can take the long road. I do not stop or object if you take the long path. Do as I say! If you realize quickly than it is nothing but gains. If not the long route is ever open and available for you. What is coming in the way? If you do as I say, then even for the long step by step approach you will it find easier. If you ask me, there will be no need for you to take the longer path. Earlier I, myself did not know about this. Without any abilites, knowledge, meditation, samadhi etc to directly attain that state, thereafter which nothing remains to be known, to be done and to acquire, this I was not aware off. When I was not aware of it, I engaged in many disciplines and restrictions, I stayed in solitude, I gave up meeting any one. You will be surprised to know that I even weighed the roti (indian bread) before eating, to avoid eating more than absolutely essential. Same with sleep, to sleep only a limited time. I kept very few possessions with me. I did not ask anyone for anything. "I do not have this thing.".. I never said this to anyone. I stayed like this for many years. I underwent many hardships. If I share with you, you will be shocked.

I know that when a sadhu does not ask for anything, he is better received, and there is great peace around him. And if he seeks something from another, then he will be lowered in the eyes of the others. Whoever he asks from, he will become lowered in their eyes and he will become a "taker". And the one he is asking from, he will become their slave. Saying all these things is not good, but I am saying this to make you believe, and have faith in the fact that I have tried all of these things and seen for myself. This too is a path, but it is a long path. Whatever spiritual disciplines you engage in, will never go to waste. But it will take a long time. My passion is around how to quickly and with ease one can attain realization / salvation? I continue to search on this even today !

Simply speaking, I have concluded by this one sentence which says it all - IF YOU WANT ANYTHING FOR YOUR SELF ! IT IS DEATH.

From "Bhagavat Praapti ki Sugamtaah" in Hindi by Swami Ramsukhdasji pg 67-69.

-----------------------------

Question: What does it mean by 'To know One's self'?

Answer:
Wanting something for ourselves, that itself is "death" (not knowing
one's true Self). We want medicine, we want clothes, we want a
house, we want something for transportation, then all this is very
lowly. When we have become a slave to things, then we have become
super inferior, simply base. How can we be elevated? I feel very
bad when someone asks for things. It feels as if, some one has
thrown a shoe at me. The ascetics who stay with me, when they ask
me for a particular thing, then this is a great insult; it is not
the quality of an ascetic to ask. Rather it is not even humanity !
Man is needed by others. Even if daily roti (bread) is not
available, so be it. You say that if we don't eat, we will die,
then are we not going to die after eating rotis? Whether you die
eating, or you die without eating, you have to definitely die. Then
why die being a slave ? Being contemptible, being oppressed why
should we die? Die, then die with dignity ! By not asking for
anything, results in immense peace. There is great Joy ! Life is a
success ! There is so much gain that there is no end to it. There
is such immense benefit, one that could not be experienced in any
birth.

I heard the story of a sadhu (ascetic). Some sadhus had gone to
Badrinarayan. There, one of the sadhus had pain in one of his
fingers. Someone told him that since you are in pain, there is a
hospital nearby, where all are treated for free. You go there and
get the dressing for this wound. The sadhu said, that this pain I
will bare, but the pain of asking someone to dress the wound, will
not be tolerable. This is the example that came to my mind of true
sacrifice. This point appeared so great and appealing to me, that
this is true ascetism, true humanity. Just like a dog that goes
wandering around from place to place for morsel of food, similarly
one who goes from place to place, does not have true humanity.
Asceticism (state of a sadhu) is out of the question. Sethji (Shri
Jayadayalji Goendka) was a householder, he too used to say that if
you want to engage in worship of God, first ask your mind, is there
anything you want? Then say - no I don't want anything, After
saying so, then engage in worship and devotion of God. If a
householder says these things, then what is there for a sadhu to
want?

Questioner: Maharajji, how will our work/life go on?
Swamiji: Why do we want work to go on, we want to stop it.

Questioner: If this body becomes diseased, then without medicines
how will our work/life continue?
Swamiji: If it doesn't work, then what happens? It will die !
then those who take medicines don't they die ?

Questioner: Without medicines they will die suffering
Swamiji: Do those that take medicine, don't suffer or what? Taking
medicines, in the end feeling defeated, feeling tired they die, then
they too die after going through suffering. The point is the same
and same only ! From within having no want / desire, then you will
not experience the pain of dependency. It will be joyful ! It
will be blissful !

There is one man who has renounced everything and one who is poor.
Both don't have any money. No shoes, no umbrella, nothing ! Both
are in the same state, but are they the same from within? A
renunciate is very blissful from within, not possible in one who is
dependent. He who needs somethings, some medicines, is highly
dependent !

Questioner: But disease causes pain !
Swamiji: During the hot months, when the Sun is directly overhead,
a person having lit fire on all four sides, is sitting in the
center, the austere one, does he not experience pain? The pain
from austerities is out of his choice, whereas the pain resulting
from disease, is an austerity that God has showered upon us. Tell
me, which austerity is better? Therefore when faced with an
illness, a disease, if one believes that it is by God's will that
this austerity is happening, then there is joy even in pain and
suffering. A person, maintains a fast and does not eat any food,
and another being poor, does not get any food and therefore does not
eat. Both remain hungry, but the one who had maintained a fast, he
does not feel unhappy on not eating, rather he is joyful in not
eating.

--------------------------------------------------------

Renounce Relationship by the Self

We have discussed earlier that bondage is the relation between body and world which we have assumed. Now this relation is assumed by the Self and it can be broken only by the Self. The mind and intellect can assist in breaking it, but the complete breaking takes place only when the Self breaks it. The intellect only assists in breaking this relation. I speak about karan nirpeksh - because this relation can be broken without the assistance of the intellect also. It can
be broken independently by the Self - because it is the Self which has assumed this relation.

The Self is a part of God that is Real. Therefore, the Self is also Real. Like coal starts shining when you put it in fire - the assumption of the unreal seems as real because the assumption is by the Self (which is Real). The accepted relation cannot be changed by practice. The relation will change only through acceptance by the Self. I am God's and God is mine. This body is not me nor mine. Like a married man's relationship with the wife's family is only because
of the relation with the wife. If the wife dies, the relation with the in-laws becomes distant. Similarly the body is like the 'wife'. Break your relation with the body and the relation with the world will also break-off. This relation is a future invitation for birth and death. This relation is the assumption of me and mine.

Changing 'yourself' is a very good spiritual practice. Accept that the body is not me, nor mine and not for me. I am God's. We may study and gain spiritual knowledge, but this will achieve nothing except inflate our ego, and ultimately nothing will be attained. All that will happen is that we will attach to another relation (i.e. I am so knowledgeable). We have to leave the relation by the Self
- not by the body. If simply by breaking the relation with this body was required all who died would have attained salvation. The body is not yours. It is for service of others only. By serving others your feeling of 'mineness' (mamta) will go away. Nothing in this world is yours. You say 'my wife' - so is she only your wife? No. She is someone's sister, mother, daughter, aunt etc.

Q. The relation will be left only when the Self leaves it, so what is the use of the intellect? A. Intellect is only for service of others. Leaving by Self is best and in the end it has to be left by the Self. The intellect assists in renunciation. That is why I say it is karan nirpeksh, i.e. You are not dependent on it. The relation is made by the Self, not by the intellect. It has to be broken by the Self. The relation with the world is only for it's service. You can renounce
only in human life. Human life is for renunciation only. You get instant peace by renunciation (Gita 12:12). Renounce from within. It is of no use just wearing orange robes, if renunciation is not happening from within.

Q. The intellect helps in renouncing the world. Does the Self renounce
anything?
A. The Self renounces the ego (Aham) - the my-ness, the 'I'. Leaving of 'me' and 'mine' is by the Self. If the 'I' goes, the 'am' will become 'is'. This cannot be attained by practice. Practice will make you reach a new situation. But attainment is by acceptance only.
-----------------------------------------------------

You may read the following Gita Talk discussions -

Relationship between Atma and Paramatma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gita-talk/message/1486

Why "atma" has assumed affinity with nature (prakriti) ?
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gita-talk/message/3256

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[gita-talk] Re: The Bhagavad Gita - Daily Message - 6-36

 


Shree Hari
|| Ram Ram ||

6-36

asamyataatmana yogo, dushpraapa iti me matih
vashyatmana tu yatata, shakyo 'vaptum upaayatah

Meaning

Yoga is difficult to achieve by one whose mind is not completely subdued, but it can easily by achieved by him, who has controlled his mind and who strives ceaselessly; such is My conviction. 36

Comment

Arjuna thought, restlessness of mind as the barrier to attaining perfection in Dhyanayoga. But in fact the restlessness of mind is not so much of an obstacle as the lack of control of mind. The faithful wife does not concentrate her mind, but she keeps the mind under control.

With the ability to concentrate the mind (due to attachment in mind and intellect), one attains certain occult powers, with coming of these powers, relationship with the world (Jadata or inert) remains.

The second point, to concentrate the mind, practice is necessary which is not possible without the help of the world (Jadata).

The third point, with the concentration, the mind develops dispassion for some time and then falls out of it. This happens only due to the relationship with the world.

The conclusion is that on achieving concentration the relationship with the world is not abandoned but when the attachment is gone for good then the relationship with the world is broken. Therefore, in Lord's view, the concentration of mind is not important but one should be free of attachment.

For controlling the mind, i.e. purifying the mind, there are two techniques--

Not have likes and dislikes (Raaga and Dwesha) with anything and seeing God in all. As long as a person continues to have likes and dislikes, till then he cannot see God in all. As long as an aspirant does not see God in all, till then mind cannot be completely controlled. The reason is that as long as aspirant believes existence of another entity besides God, till then the mind cannot be mastered.

From "Gita Prabodhani" in hindi by Swami Ramsukhdasji
----------------------------------------------------------

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The Bhagavadgita - SADHAK SANJIVANI ENGLISH
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[gita-talk] Re: Are we Giving Importance to what we know to be TRUE? Your Insights Please !

 

Shree Hari Ram Ram

In recent "SADHAKA DAILY MESSAGES" Swamiji has addressed giving importance to
what we know to be TRUE....
Are we utilizing what we know to be true? Have we understood the term
"perishable" (naashvaan). Do we know ourselves as imperishable? Do we know that
the imperishable cannot be gratified by the perishable?
Are we getting trapped? Are we being stupid? Are we cheating ourselves? Do we
know / understand that it is only on realizing the Eternal, Imperishable
Paramatma that we will be satisfied?

Your INSIGHTS please !!!
Gita Talk Moderators, Ram Ram

-----------------------------------------------

Hari Om

Problem is that we 'know' but we do not 'accept' ! In Hindi : HAM JAANATE HAIN LEKIN MAANATE NAHIN !

We know whatever rises, sets. We know who ever takes birth, dies! Who does not know that? But still, if some near and dear dies, we grieve ! At the same time, we do not grieve when in the evening the Sun sets. In the latter case,we 'know' as well as 'accept' that the Sun sets in the evening. So we do not grieve. In the former case, we 'know' one must die, but we do not 'accept' ..hence we become sorrowful.

We 'know' smoking is bad, still we smoke. We 'know' telling lies is bad, still we tell lies. We 'know' greed is bad, still we become swayed by greed. Why ? We 'know' but we do not 'accept' !

We know the nature of 'perishable' still we ' like to accept' the perishable to be 'permanent' !! Oh...how much trouble we take to justify our insistence of somehow seeing permanency in temporary ... including even bringing Vasudev Sarvam truth ... What do we not do to see what we 'know' is perishable but we do not 'accept' to be perishable ? Amazing ...!!!

Hence we must re-visit our 'acceptances' ( beliefs/assumptions / affinities/ connections) ....!

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

-------------------------------------------------

Spiritual wisdom is that.....

All creation, perishable or not perishable, is for our happiness and satisfaction......every little thing/situation/relationship in this world is for our happiness.....We need to have that helicopter view to enjoy every moment.... Perishable is not to be worried about but understood in right perspective and to be used as the invisible ladder for going up to that eternal happiness...

Understanding, experimenting, experiencing the wisdom of life is the doorway to that bliss..... i.e. eternal is achieved only when our every moment is established in that unconditional bright happiness (beyond happiness and unhappiness)....

Remember, we all have that happy natural state (HNS) within us....... HNS is that state of "Nothing" from where originate everything...
Strong understanding, awareness and experience, helps the ball rolling and builds the conviction.....contemplation is the key...

Sushil Jain

--------------------------------------------------

until our last breath we ourselves and people around us feel and take us to be present and never feel we are perishable and upto that time we are true although wek now that ATMA is imperishable as said in sri Gitaji  nainam chindanti shastrani----------------------

how then a person has to differentiate between perishable and non perishable . what i feel from sri Gita ji karmanye dhivadhikaraste--------should be followed for grihasth peapleÂ
jai shri krishna

Chaman nigam
----------------------------------------------

Dear Gita-group,

Yes, everyone is giving too much importance to physical/maya
truth. All of you have nothing else to go by. You all are reading
Bhagwat-Gita like a parrot and you are not applying the teachings
of Bhagwat Gita on yourself. Bhagwat-Gita talks about consciousness,
devotion and transcendence. These three words will teach you
how to "transform your thoughts from physical-thoughts to non-
physical-thoughts (God, higher power, source). This process will
begin to find your "absolute"/non-physical truth.

You will have to raise the level of mind/consciousness, prayers/devotion
and this process will be beyond-physical/transcendence. Reading
Gita is all physical and you may not find your answers this way,
instead, you will find coflicts, confusions and you may go into
junter-munter of New Delhi as many people (of your group) have
been going there and getting lost.

Good Luck! Bye!

Notesh Otes
--------------------------------------------------

Dear Sadhakas, it is a great invitation to share our insights into what
Moderators and Nagaji have shred with us from Swamiji's Treasure!
We need to clearly see that anything known or unknown, including body-mind-sense
complex given to us which we call "I", is perceived by senses and subsequently
conceived by mind with a name. All such conceived(thought-of) objects of this
world are in mind which functions in time-space fabric only, and hence are
perishable in time! Check this out by contemplating upon it.
Now, That which conceives objects through body-mind-senses cannot ITSELF be
conceived as another object of this world, and hence is free of time-space
fabric and therefore, is necessarily Imperishable! Even as IT cannot be known as
another object, it is our experience that IT knows through us and therefore, IT
IS, and hence is ITS own proof, being Self-evident Existence we feel we ARE!
Knowing this Truth as our true nature, the Real "I" that I am, is crown Jewel
of discrimination (Vivek Chudamani)!
So, Swamiji is asking us to stand as our true Self, the only Truth of perishable
World! This will free us from all attachment to "me" and its created world!
Know also that perishable objects exist only on Imperishable Existence, just as
waves on ocean, snake on rope, jewelries on Gold!
It is IMPERISHABLE which is GOD, appearing as forms of perishable objects!
And ... when we understand this by contemplating on it, we say "Vasudev Sarvam"!
Pratap Bhatt

---------------------------------------------------
Dear Sadaks,
We know we are perishable, and we know that we not the body, but we are Aham
Bhramasmi, we know we are trapped, we know we are stupid and cheating ourselves,
and we know we want to escape from these. But then why we are not getting out of
Maya. Strictly speaking 90% of us are aware. But what prevents us from raising
to higher level? Only very very few realized the importance. We know Geetha and
Sri Krishna and Swamiji and his teachings. But we cannot put in practice- Why?
Judge, Police, Ministers, Govt Servants know that taking bribe is crime. Person
to person cheating we know that we accumulate sins. But we do them without fear-
Why? Sadaks find out this obstacle then it is easy to liberate.
B.Sathyanarayan

-----------------------------------------------

What 'this specfic-named' person referred to by mistake as I do is what
(this) I am destined to do because of the properties/ Gunas imparted to this
particular stula-suksma-karan body mistakenlt referred to as I. This I will
cheat itself and ask why, will know that it is perishable within a very
short period of time and yet act as if that short period is infinite time,
This I is designed to act stupid, trapped in illusion even if this I comes
to know the Truth. All this is but natural and not amazing. That is one
Truth that this I also knows and need not bother. The real Truth is that
there is the Other I which is permanent, ceaseless, unperturbed by what the
perishable I's do and do not do. It is that Other I that this I is destined
to vanish in. Can the existence this other I be experienced even as this
perishable I functions in its own guna and illusion led existence. That is
the only important issue: going beyond the darkness of the perishable I to
enjoy the existence of the ceaseless I. Will this happen!
Basudeb Sen

----------------------------------------------

To feel satisfied, seek satisfaction that any possession, relationship,

situation, idea is good, important, sacred, moral, right, beneficial and so

on apart from its use, is the psychological comfort to which the mind
clings

Then is there nothing as good?

Everything has usage value and that is the only goodness of it.

Y V Chawla

Give Importance to what you Know to be True

Again, a wonderful teaching (rather a whip) from Swamiji with a precision of
RaambaaNa!
"Whatever circumstances one has been placed in, consider those circumstances and
situations as best of all and utilize it well, then you will be benefited … Your
knowledge is not less, however, what you know you are not utilizing it well … If
you utilize this knowledge properly, then this knowledge that you have is
adequate for your benefit ... proper utilization of this knowledge is that, do
not get trapped in the circumstances that have presented themselves to you -
neither become elated or dejected in them."

1. There are two terms in Sanskrit - Rita and Satya. One means perceived truth
and the other the Absolute Truth. How anyone who cannot acknowledge perceived
truth ever can appreciate the Absolute Truth?
2. An individual IS SOLELY RESPONSIBLE FOR ONE'S HAPPINESS … also the individual
is the only one who is authorised to change one's state of presence - happy or
not.
3. Finally, one does not need anything other than oneself to make oneself happy.
If anything else is used to "bring" happiness in one's life, the thing that
apparently brought the pleasure is sure to perish … and so is the pleasure it
brought along.

The best is Swamiji's response to the questioner's apparent quest for more
knowledge - "Whatever you have knowledge about, are you utilizing that knowledge
properly?" What a wonderful whip any Saadhak need to savor all the time!!!
Quoting Swamiji from other texts, "Baavar bed bidush baavariyaa poti pustak
pandhaa …". Studies through even milleniums cannot bring the awareness, if we
are not willing to utilize the know how we are graced with as of now …

We often bring the so-called "nobility" and even "divinity" to escape from our
fundamental responsibility of being happy succumbing to our eternal hesitance to
exercize the only authority we ever have - to be happy.

Respects.

Naga Narayana.

=================================================

|| Shree Hari ||
Ram Ram

Give Importance to what you Know to be True

There is one very great point. Have mercy on me and please pay attention.
Whatever circumstances one has been placed in, consider those circumstances and
situations as best of all and utilize it well, then you will be benefited.
Whatever things you have received, you don't need any more things than that.
However much knowledge you have, you don't need to know any more than that. The
amount of strength that you have, you don't need any more than that. Paramatma
(God) can be realized simply by putting to proper use the strength, the
intellect, the abilities, the circumstances etc. that you have. This is the
absolute Truth and is the principle.

Your knowledge is not less, however, what you know you are not utilizing it
well. You do not give it importance - that is your limitation. The
circumstances that have been presented in front of you, will not remain like
this forever. This knowledge is not something that you know only slightly, you
know this completely and entirely. If you utilize this knowledge properly, then
this knowledge that you have is adequate for your benefit. It is not even
slightly deficient. The proper utilization of this knowledge is that, do not
get trapped in the circumstances that have presented themselves to you. Neither
become elated or dejected in them.

Questioner: We know this point, however the extent we desire to know, that
much knowledge we do not have.

Swamiji: Whatever you have knowledge about, are you utilizing that knowledge
properly? Those things that you know to be perishable, do you have desire to
attain it or not?

Questioner: Yes we do.

Swamiji: Then where have you understood the term "perishable"? In reality, if
you truly understood "perishable", then you would not desire to attain it. What
is the gain in attaining the perishable? Just like a wealthy man has money.
Without the money he would not be called wealthy, similarly this world has only
perishables and perishing things. That which is perishable how can it benefit
us, how can it be for our welfare?

You your "self" are not perishable, rather the body is perishable. That which
you have received is going to perish, but you the "self" will not perish.
Things were not there initially and will not be there later on. Rather even in
the present it is continuously moving towards destruction. You were there
initially and will remain even after. Your existence will remain at all times.
A question was put forth to me, that in the present how to gain knowledge of our
existence in the future? The answer to that is, that you are afraid to do bad
things and you are pleased when you do good deeds; because you are of the
sentiment that by doing evil deeds you will later on suffer, and by doing good
deeds, you will gain happiness in the future. This is proof that you have
accepted your existence in the future. If we do not accept our existence in the
future, then who will go to heaven? Who will go to hell? You will be
reincarnated? Who will be liberated? On attaining salvation, you will be
blissful or will the world be joyful? The point is that you will remain, and
the body and other things will not.

If you think carefully how can that which is eternal and imperishable attain
happiness from perishable? By saying that something is perishable it means, it
is nothing but destructible, besides being destructible and perishable, it has
nothing.

"Ant tohi tajainge paamar tu ne tajai ab hi te."

That thing which is going to perish, utilize it but do not trust it. Do not
depend on it as your support, having the notion that this thing will gratify me,
that it will lead to my prosperity etc. Think deeply about this - By getting
those things that are currently not with you, how will you be gratified? How
will you prosper? That which is not there right now, will also not remain later
on in the future. It will break away, therefore how will it make you happy?
Who knows with certainty whether you get it or not? And even if you get it, then
too it will not remain, because that which is perishable and destructible will
perish.

The body etc. is perishable - this you know, but you do not believe it. In
other words, you do not give importance to that which you know to be true. If
you gave importance to what you know, then you would not depend on perishables.
You would not have any expectation or hope from these perishables. You would
not become happy on getting them or meeting them. You would not be saddened by
not getting or meeting them. You would not desire for them to remain forever
and forever. You would not worry about them perishing. On not attaining the
situations that you desire, you become unhappy. Then this unhappiness is
nothing but stupidity. It is only stupidity. To want to hold on to those
things and situations that will not remain, and later being saddened by their
departure - what else is all this besides stupidity? If some calamity comes to
us, some sorrow comes to us, than we think how will this go away? But in
reality, it is going away. Whether it is favorable situations or unfavorable
ones, they will not remain. That which comes, is of the nature to go away.

Sarve kshayaantaa nichayaah patanaantaah samuchryaah

sanyogaa viprayogontaa marayaantam cha jeevitam (Valmiki 2/105/16)

The end of all hoarding is utter annihilation. The end of all worldly
successes is a fall. The end of coming together is parting ways. The end of
life is death.

That which is going to part, how can one gain happiness on meeting it? What is
there to be unhappy by it's going away. Neither happiness remains, nor sorrow
remains. Only the self remains. If the one that remains (Self), becomes one
that which comes and goes, one that is happy and sad, then it is only it's own
foolishness.

It is only on attaining That which never perishes, and That which is present
right now, Paramatma, one will gain the kind of happiness that remains forever.
Besides Paramatma if you become satisfied with anything else, whether it is
respect, honor, fame, relaxation, money, family, prosperity etc., you will be
cheated.

(to be continued)

From book in hindi "Acche Bano" and english "Be Good" by Swami Ramsukhdasji

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Same message is available in HINDI - PLEASE VISIT:
http://www.satcharcha.blogspot.com
Titled "Acche Bano" on 23nd February, 2011.
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Saturday, February 26, 2011

[gita-talk] Re: Seeking Direction regarding Reading Sadhak Sanjivani and Gita Study

 

Respected Sirs,

I have been reading various small summary books on Bhagavadgeeta. Now I have the
intention to start reading Swamiji's Sadhak Sanjivani - 2 volumes. Can you
please guide me from which chapter I should start reading. I don't want to loose
it. I am determined to read it completely and meaningfully (even if it takes
long time). I heard that Geeta study should start from chapter 12?
Kindly guide me in the right direction.

Regards,
Padma

======================================

in my view u must start from page one letter one
Not a single word must be left
I have done it and advice u to do it.
If u have intention to know it complete
raja gurdasani

--------------------------------------

Shree Hari Ram Ram

I have been reading for some time, but what has struck me of recent is to study the Sadhak Sanjivani deeply and sincerely, to understand with deep profundity what is being revealed, and immediately put into creative practice, the knowledge gained with a view to spiritual advancement. Sadhak Sanjivani does not promote a particular philosophical view, rather it is a life giving boon, like the Sanjivani herb for all aspirants, no matter what faith, creed. religion, language or place they belong to.

Meera Das, Ram Ram

----------------------------------------

I sincerely thank the moderators for sending this useful message with links. It
is very useful. I am not a computer person and find it difficult to read it
online. Is there a way to download and print it? I know this topic had been
discussed earlier but this info from you is very useful.

Thank you,
Padma
------------------------------------

Shree Hari Ram Ram

Thank you Padmaji, We are glad you found these useful. Little work has been
done to consolidate the past messages into a meaningful respository that is
easily downloadable. However you can cut and past these into word or notepad or
wordpad and print. a You canlso print as-is from the links. Hope to start
making progress in this direction soon !
Gita Talk Moderators, Ram Ram

--------------------------------------

Hari Om

Your sentiments, Padmaji, regarding Holy Gita are representative of what is
called in Scriptures as 'Shubheccha' (auspicious desire). My compliments. JUST
AS: Jaggery is sweet from all sides SIMILARLY: Holy Gita is beneficial from all
sides...whether you read Chapter 12 first ..or 15:6 ! Memorizing Gita verses and
doing reverse 'paath' gives you intant , amazing peace too...! So why not to
start from Chapter 1 and grasp it the way Arjuna did? Sadhak Sanjeevani is a
'prasadik' treatise...written exclusively for emancipation of Sadhaks by Param
Shraddheya Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj ! Fortunate are we , that we have access
to such a Treatise.

The best way to read Sadhak Sanjivani is to 'surrender' to Gitaji teachings. The
holy Gita is very deep. You can not take its teachings by your mind and
intellect. For intellectuals, Gita becomes a riddle. Hence you should surrender
to its teachings first. In case something is not understood, you should presume
that whatever is written is right and you should endeavour to change your
understanding (mind/intellect) accordingly. That then is the time to change your
understanding and belief...whatever is written in Sadhak Sanjivani is NOT
subject to change...you must change...think this way !! Start from Foreword /
Index ..and endeavour not not to miss a word !!! Read regularly ..!

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

------------------------------------

Madam,
First see the fundamental question. What is impelling you to study? Connect what
you study with yourself. See what is written as 'live' and not as a theory to be
applied for getting results. Realisation is not accumulation of knowledge. It is
mutation in the brain itself. I would like to add :
'No theory, philosophy or technique can lead you to be in that state. At the
most, they can take you to the inquiry state, the journey beyond which is
exclusive. No book, no teaching can go further. These can feed your inquiry.
Once you yourself enquire into your own inner working, the function of the book
is over. You take your own path. Till that time, you are simply gratified by
books or teachers against your present state which you term as unsatisfactory.'

Y V Chawla

Shree Hari Ram Ram

Swamiji highly recommended reading Gita Madhurya before study of Gita. You may
Read and listen to Gita Madhurya (English)

AUDIO - http://www.swamiramsukhdasji.net/audio.html
and click on GITA MADHURYA

BOOK ENGLISH - http://www.swamiramsukhdasji.net/ebooks.html
and click on GITA MADHURYA

BOOK HINDI - http://www.swamiramsukhdasji.net/ebooks.html
and click on link to HINDI BOOKS and click on GITA MADHURYA

Sadhaks if you have not visited these resources it is a MUST !!!
DO NOT WAIT ! CLICK RIGHT NOW !!

Let us know how you liked these FREE resources.

Gita Talk Moderators, Ram Ram

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PREVIOUS RELATED SADHAKA DAILY MESSAGE

Methods of Recitation of the Gita - 1
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Bhagavad Gita - Introduction - Part 2
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Essence of the Gita (Gita Saar) � Chapters 7-12
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sadhaka/message/1640

Essence of the Gita (Gita Saar) � Chapters 13-18
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sadhaka/message/1641

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